Subject: [removed] Digest V2004 #103
From: <[removed]@[removed]>
Date: 3/20/2004 2:55 PM
To: <[removed]@[removed];

------------------------------


                            The Old-Time Radio Digest!
                              Volume 2004 : Issue 103
                         A Part of the [removed]!
                             [removed]
                                 ISSN: 1533-9289


                                 Today's Topics:

  Re: Berle again                       [ Dixonhayes@[removed] ]
  Berle and Other East Coast Shows      [ George Aust <austhaus1@[removed] ]
  Welcome Jim Harmon                    [ "steven kostelecky" <skostelecky@ho ]
  Uncle Miltie vs. Amos n Andy          [ JackBenny@[removed] ]
  Mercedes McCambridge and 1001 Wives   [ "Irene Heinstein" <IreneTH@[removed] ]
  Milton Berle on radio                 [ "B. J. Watkins" <kinseyfan@hotmail. ]
  Re: More Berle                        [ Elizabeth McLeod <lizmcl@[removed] ]
  otr in the early 60's:                [ "Bob and Carol Taylor" <shadowcole@ ]
  buying a tv                           [ "gary hagan" <grhagan@[removed]; ]
  Opposite Milton Berle                 [ "Robert Yellen" <ryellen@[removed]; ]
  A New War of the Worlds               [ "Randall F. Miller Jr." <rfmillerjr ]
  Who was milties competition?          [ Jer51473@[removed] ]
  Fulton Sheen                          [ Jim Widner <jwidner@[removed]; ]
  Re: Half-Hour Former Serials          [ "Jim Harmon" <jimharmonotr@charter. ]
  Paul Frees books are in!!             [ benohmart@[removed] ]
  [removed]                              [ Ron Sayles <bogusotr@[removed]; ]

------------------------------

Date: Sat, 20 Mar 2004 00:50:20 -0500
From: Dixonhayes@[removed]
To: [removed]@[removed]
Subject:  Re: Berle again
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In a message dated 3/19/04 1:52:46 PM Central Standard Time,
[removed]@[removed] writes:

The saddest thing about it all, for us collectors, is that few of the great
kines of the show are [removed] thrashed them inorder to have more space
for
contemporary shows.

I thought Berle sued NBC and NBC consequently managed to find all of the old
kinescopes.  Some of them are available on home video from places like Shokus
Video, and at one point, shortly after Berle's death, TV Land was even
reported to be negotiating for rerun rights to the "Texaco Star Theatre."

Dixon

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Date: Sat, 20 Mar 2004 00:51:00 -0500
From: George Aust <austhaus1@[removed];
To: OTR Digest <[removed]@[removed];
Subject:  Berle and Other East Coast Shows

When we got our first TV in late 1948 about the time I turned 12 yrs
old, we had already seen quite a bit of TV at the neighbors. For us kids
the big draw was Hopalong Cassidy. The cry all over the neighborhood
would go out "Hoppy's on" and everybody would head home or to a friends
home who owned a TV.  Never once did I hear "Uncle Milty's on".
One difference could very well be that I lived (and still do) in
California, and east coast TV shows just seemed so silly, so corny!
Milton Berle was the epitome of that type of humor. In addition the
technical ability of New York cameramen and I suppose directors was zip!
On the variety shows the cameramen always cut off the feet of dancers
while always managing to get the mike boom in the shot.
The shows originating from the west coast seemed so much slicker and
much more cleverly written. There were exceptions of course. Your Show
Of Shows was great, but there weren't many. Our family did like Ed Wynn
a lot. Silly? Yes, but there was something very likable about his
nervous nelly character that was endearing.
So we were in that tiny percentage of people that had sets that didn't
watch Milton and our TV was on! Whats more I don't remember the kids at
school talking about Berle the next day. I don't remember any of my
friends watching that show. I do remember all the hooplah about it and
wondering why. We did watch the show that was on before Berle apparently
because I remember seeing the opening with the Texaco men opening the
show a lot.
I think that Arthur Godfrey was very popular here, but that was a little
later and Toast of the Town also was watched quite a bit. Martin and
Lewis who were funny in the movies were just plain silly on their TV
show. Perhaps because in Los Angeles we had four channels to choose from
early on is why Uncle Milty was not as big a sensation as in other parts
of the country. Years later I found Berle to be very funny for instance
when he hosted the Academy Awards show.

 I don't remember any such disparity on the radio shows, either
technically or artistically,just TV.

George Aust

------------------------------

Date: Sat, 20 Mar 2004 00:55:07 -0500
From: "steven kostelecky" <skostelecky@[removed];
To: [removed]@[removed]
Subject:  Welcome Jim Harmon

I'm ashamed I haven't posted this 'til now, but it is amazing how work can
turn your brain to mush. I'd like to welcome Jim Harmon to the Digest. His
book THE GREAT RADIO HEROES made a deep impression on me as a youth who was
dying to learn about the shows my dad told me about. Of course as time has
gone on there are those who would disparage some of the inaccuracies in
HEROES, but when it was written it was a different time. We now have
(nearly) immediate access to information and the ability to correct
misinformation through the otr internet community. However at the time there
was a much smaller group of collectors huddled around mimeograph machines
and anxious to see who would uncover the next block of a series so they
could be shared and written about.
Mr. Harmon wrote with great wit and insight into the shows he loved. He also
wrote science fiction and I had the pleasure of gnawing rubber chicken as he
spoke at the banquet of the Oklahoma City Comicon in 1970. He related a
story of riding a bus in the city and being the target of "hippie jokes"
because he had rather athletic sideburns. He helped make a memorable
experience more memorable.
When I finally stumbled back onto the otr community the first show I hoped
to get episodes of was I Love A Mystery thanks mostly to Mr. Harmon's
boundless enthusiasm and vivid description of the show. It has since become
the family favorite.
So thanks, Mr. Harmon, and welcome aboard. I look forward to your posts.
Best,
Steve

------------------------------

Date: Sat, 20 Mar 2004 12:04:29 -0500
From: JackBenny@[removed]
To: [removed]@[removed]
Subject:  Uncle Miltie vs. Amos n Andy

Here's one that will probably be addressed by Elizabeth (well, hey, y'all
expect me to jump on the Benny stuff), but is open to everyone.

I happened to be doing some research today on radio ratings from 1932 to
1942.  And I noticed [removed] once in all those years was Amos n Andy
in
the top five.  Now in 1930-31 they had a [removed] rating (WOW!) and in 1931-32 had
[removed]  But by 1932, they had fallen into the high 20s and the dial was being
commanded by Eddie Cantor, Ed Wynn, and Baron Munchausen.

I found this very surprising, with the legendary stories of EVERYONE
listening to Amos n Andy, stores closing down for it, theatres stopping the
movie,
etc.  However, it seems like their heyday was over by 1932, although their
ratings are still respectable while not tops.  So with all the talk about
communal
watching of Milton Berle, it makes me wonder if something similar was
happening
with Amos n Andy.

Granted, chances were probably greater that people were able to make their
own radios during the 1920s with wire around the Quaker Oats box and the
aerial
hooked to the radiator, while few people were making their own television
sets.  Also, I have some beautiful commercial radios made in the 1924-1927
range,
so the proliferation of sets may have been greater than the proliferation of
TVs at Berle's time.  But a) how much did Amos n Andy contribute to the sale
of
radio sets, and b) how much communal listening of AnA took place, with the
stories of stopping the movie for it, [removed]

--Laura Leff
President, IJBFC
[removed]

------------------------------

Date: Sat, 20 Mar 2004 12:05:19 -0500
From: "Irene Heinstein" <IreneTH@[removed];
To: "OTR" <[removed]@[removed];
Subject:  Mercedes McCambridge and 1001 Wives

I have an episode of '1001 Wives' from 9/1/39 entitled 'Lori O'Donnell'and
it stars Mercedes McCambridge.   Absolutely wonderful performance; very
moving.  This seems to be the only episode of this series available.
Thankfully, it was one with Mercedes McCambridge.

Irene

------------------------------

Date: Sat, 20 Mar 2004 12:08:12 -0500
From: "B. J. Watkins" <kinseyfan@[removed];
To: [removed]@[removed]
Subject:  Milton Berle on radio

Udmacon@[removed] asked:

Aside: who was the actor/actress who portrayed Martha on Berle's radio
show. Martha's only
line: "Yawwwssss!"

I've always assumed it was Milton Berle himself. Wasn't it?

Barbara

------------------------------

Date: Sat, 20 Mar 2004 12:11:05 -0500
From: Elizabeth McLeod <lizmcl@[removed];
To: <[removed]@[removed];
Subject:  Re: More Berle

On 3/20/04 12:51 AM [removed]@[removed] wrote:

I can't imagine why Berle's influence is in dispute.   The arguments run
against the professional and popular perceptions of the time, never
challenged, except here.

Actually, the matter of just how widespread Berle's audience was has been
a matter of discussion among broadcast historians for quite some time.
Probably the most comprehensive analysis of the subject is "The Rise and
Fall of Milton Berle," by Arthur Frank Wertheim, an essay published in
1983 in the anthology "American History, American Television," available
in any good college library. Wertheim is a careful scholar of
broadcasting history and its influence on popular culture (as anyone
who's read his "Radio Comedy" will recognize), and he makes the following
points:

"The most significant element in understanding Berle's popularity is that
during its height the comedian's audience was almost exclusively
[removed] was not entertaining a wide geographical cross section of
Americans, but primarily viewers in cities, particularly in places such
as New York." -- Wertheim, p. 69

"While the number of operating stations increased from 108 in 1952 to 354
in 1954, Berle's ratings did not increase. His citified comic style was
not really suited to the new small-town and rural audiences. Berle's
problem as a 'city' comedian reflected a longstanding urban versus rural
conflict in American [removed] testings of local markets have
revealed that preferences for comedy shows can vary regionally and that a
'city' comedian popular in the urban Northeast might not be popular in
the South. An American Research Bureau survey published in Variety in May
1954 reported that in Charlotte, NC, Berle's rating was only [removed],
compared to a figure of [removed] for his competition, 'Death Valley Days.'
Given the choice between a popular 'western' program and Berle, rural
viewers seemingly preferred the former."
-- Wertheim, p. 74

"Berle's particular type of urban vaudeville humor was responsible for
both his rise and [removed] by the novelty of television, viewers
in American cities, particularly New York, first found Berle hilarious
and were responsible for his popularity. Yet even these fans began to
tire of his vaudeville slapstick routines and switched to other programs
as the prime time schedule expanded. Berle's main failing, however, was
his inability to attract a large audience outside the cities." --
Wertheim p. 76

Why we should want to rain on the parade of one of the first members of the
TV Hall of Fame I don't know.    Numbers aren't everything and I say this as
a retired finance officer/senior accountant.

I wouldn't call a discussion of this topic raining on anyone's parade.
Understanding history, whether it's broadcasting history or any other
sort of history, means that one must always be willing to investigate and
question the Conventional Wisdom regardless of how deeply entrenched it
might be. From my perspective, I think that understanding what was really
going on in television between 1948 and 1951 doesn't at all diminish
Berle's place in that history -- but it's absolutely *essential* in
explaining why he went from the very top of the medium to hosting
"Jackpot Bowling" within the space of a decade, while many of those
comedians who followed in his immediate wake were able to carve out far
more enduring careers. Wertheim refers to Berle as one of television's
first *victims* as well as one of its first successes, and I think that
comment is extremely apt.

I don't say any of this as a Berle basher, by the way. I actually find
his 1947-48 radio work extremely enjoyable -- more so, in fact, than what
I've seen of his television programs.

Elizabeth

------------------------------

Date: Sat, 20 Mar 2004 12:30:01 -0500
From: "Bob and Carol Taylor" <shadowcole@[removed];
To: <[removed]@[removed];
Subject:  otr in the early 60's:

What was the last otr show on the radio?

What was the longest running show on the air?

Bob Taylor

[ADMINISTRIVIA: Solely for the purpose of the mailing list, "Old-Time Radio"
is defined as the period between the first experimental radio broadcasts in
the United States (oldest surviving approximately 1915) to the end of network
dramatic programming in late 1962, specifically September 30, 1962 with the
final airings of Suspense and Yours Truly, Johnny Dollar on CBS.

That doesn't mean it is "definitive," only that because there are _so_ many
different lines one could draw (even after September 1962 there were still
programs which began in the OTR era [removed] Radio Mystery Theater, from
the perspective of today, may be considered [removed] the Star Wars radio
drama I recorded on reel from WITF in _Hershey_ aired over twenty years ago),
an arbitrary line had to be drawn to guide the discussion, so I drew it
there.  --cfs3]

------------------------------

Date: Sat, 20 Mar 2004 12:31:50 -0500
From: "gary hagan" <grhagan@[removed];
To: <[removed]@[removed];
Subject:  buying a tv

Why did my parents buy our first television?  Because the kids wanted to see
"The Lone Ranger" on tv.  We didn't even like Milton Berle.  Thought he was
corny.  (Sorry)  We would watch tv at the appliance store through the window
and sitting on the floor in the showroom when the salesmen would let us.
They would kick us out when there were a lot of customers but we could still
watch through the window.  The biggest kick was being able to see what all of
the radio stars looked like.  Still love it!

------------------------------

Date: Sat, 20 Mar 2004 12:32:50 -0500
From: "Robert Yellen" <ryellen@[removed];
To: <[removed]@[removed];
Subject:  Opposite Milton Berle

chet norris wrote

NOT to take anything away from milton [removed] was one of my [removed]
i stood in front of store windows to watch him [removed] we got our
round screen packard bell [removed] was his competition? who
was he up against in his time period? no one that i can [removed]
about you?

Bishop Sheen was on opposite Uncle Milty
>From [removed]

When, in 1951, the Archdiocese of New York decided to enter the world of
television, Sheen was a natural choice to appear on screen. The initial
half-hour lectures were broadcast on the tiny Dumont Network, opposite big
budget programs by comedian Milton Berle, "Mr. Television," and singer-actor
Frank Sinatra. No one gave Sheen a chance to compete effectively. Soon,
however, Sheen took the country by storm, winning an Emmy, appearing on the
cover of Time magazine, and entering the "most admired" list of Americans.
In its second year, "Life Is Worth Living" moved to the ABC Network and had
a sponsor, the Admiral Corporation.

------------------------------

Date: Sat, 20 Mar 2004 12:33:06 -0500
From: "Randall F. Miller Jr." <rfmillerjr1@[removed];
To: <[removed]@[removed];
Subject:  A New War of the Worlds
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Apparently there is a new War of the Worlds production being planned:
[removed],12271,1171975,[removed]
Thought you might be interested.
--Randy Miller Senior Engineer WITF-TV/FM/Radio PA

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Date: Sat, 20 Mar 2004 12:33:26 -0500
From: Jer51473@[removed]
To: [removed]@[removed]
Subject:  Who was milties competition?
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Not sure that has anything to do with his effect on tv. He made tv and tv
made him. Of all the tv programs at the time, and probably since then, his
was in
the most demand. His has been the only one that has created a "mania" similar
to that of amos and andy on radio. For several years, no star could have
overtaken him, or at least none did. Sure it had to do with the novelty of
tv, but
milton was the guy chosen and he did the job. Tv was on every night, but it
was Tuesdays that those with tvs knew company would call. Btw, ive never had
any interest in his otr, but recently i listened to a couple of his 47-48
programs and they were very good, imo. His insulting type humer rivaled bob
hope or
actually topped him, again imo. Ill be looking for a good mp3 that include his
later shows. The guy was a rapid fire comic that could sometimes get on my
nerves, but his ceasless effort and sillyness would always end up cracking me
up. The great thing about most of the really funny comics back then was the
fact
that they didnt need smut, politics, or political correctness to be funny and
make people laugh. Exit andy griffith and dick van dycke (sp) and enter "all
in the family".

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Date: Sat, 20 Mar 2004 12:34:16 -0500
From: Jim Widner <jwidner@[removed];
To: [removed]@[removed]
Subject:  Fulton Sheen

Joe Ross commented:

Bishop Sheen was a bit of a showman and cracked jokes during his talk.  He
would use a blackboard to illustrate a point, then move away from the board
for a moment.  Then when he returned to the blackboard, it would be erased,
and he would say that his "angel" had erased it for him.

While I'm not much for watching the religious stations on cable, I did
catch reruns of his old b/w shows on EWTN which were fun to watch because
my parents had him on regularly.  Anyone know if EWTN still shows them?  I
had forgotten some of the antics that Sheen did such as the one Joe Ross
mentioned in the above quote and it was fun to revisit that when I came
across the EWTN replays.

Dunning only mentions in two places the appearance of Archbishop Sheen on
radio - The Catholic Hour and a reference to "his radio show" under some
comments about Family Theater. Can anyone elaborate on his radio work?  Was
it syndicated?

Jim Widner
jwidner@[removed]

------------------------------

Date: Sat, 20 Mar 2004 12:49:25 -0500
From: "Jim Harmon" <jimharmonotr@[removed];
To: <[removed]@[removed];
Subject:  Re: Half-Hour Former Serials

In the half-hour segment, Sky King did fine.
<snip>
But Captain Midnight!  To put it aviationally, it went into a death
spiral.  It had been written down to a gradeschool level, and some of the
shows were almost laughable as compared to the adventures in the serials.

Stephan and all -- You know, I don't think I even heard most of these
half-hour Captain Midnight shows.   I can't remember anything about this
handkerchief business.   My great love was Tom Mix, of course, and I made
sure I listened to that, but I was 17 by this time and I may have heard the
half-hour CM once in awhile.
It does sound pretty bad.
    My favorite after Mix was Sky King.   It may have been "juvenile" but it
sure moved, and was exciting.  I never cared much for the half-hour Jack
Armstrong either.   I was in Southern Illinois and I could get a St. Louis
station that carried Sky King/Jack Armstrong a half-hour earlier at 4:30
while the Mutual hour began at 5 with Tom Mix/CM at 5:30, so I could hear
them all.  I think I skipped some Armstrong as well as the Captain.
    I also liked some of the half-hours created especially for that time
slot like Straight Arrow, Mark Trail, Bobby Benson (I know there was a very
early serial of it)  and Challenge of the Yukon.  I liked Curley Bradley,
the Singing Marshal at first, but then as they made changes making it less
like "Tom Mix" I lost interest in that.   At one time, Curley was on five
days a week for a half hour in the old Mix slot.
    I loved the old original Captain Midnight series too.  But something
triggers something within each of us and, unlike Stephan, I became fixated
on Tom Mix.
    Jim Harmon

------------------------------

Date: Sat, 20 Mar 2004 12:49:56 -0500
From: benohmart@[removed]
To: [removed]@[removed]
Subject:  Paul Frees books are in!!

Yes, THE BOOKS ARE IN!!!!!!! I just got the Paul Frees books - one's
in my hand right now. It's a great looking piece of work and I'm
VERY proud of it. To all those who've ordered, I start shipping them
out to you today. Thanks for your patience, but I think you'll
agree, this one's been worth the wait.

Ben Ohmart

--
Voice of The Haunted Mansion, Boris
Badenov, The Pillsbury Doughboy & more
[removed] - the official biography

------------------------------

Date: Sat, 20 Mar 2004 13:40:25 -0500
From: Ron Sayles <bogusotr@[removed];
To: Olde Tyme Radio List <[removed]@[removed];
Subject:  [removed]

For those who live in the Milwaukee area, just a reminder that the Milwaukee
Area Radio Enthusiasts will be holding their bimonthly meeting this coming
Sunday (3-21) at 2 [removed] It will be held in the Community Room (G110) at the
Mayfair Mall. Ralph Luedtke, past president and current vice-president of
[removed]  will be discussing a local favorite of the 1930s and 1940s, Heinie
and His Grenadiers who were broadcast on WTMJ from 1932 to 1944  with
Jack Bundy as Heinie. If possible plan on attending it should be a fun
afternoon.

Ron Sayles
President of the Milwaukee Area Radio Enthusiasts (MARE)

--------------------------------
End of [removed] Digest V2004 Issue #103
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