Subject: [removed] Digest V2005 #143
From: [removed]@[removed]
Date: 5/8/2005 4:18 PM

To: [removed]@[removed]

    ------------------------------

                                The Old-Time Radio Digest!
                                  Volume 2005 : Issue 143
                             A Part of the [removed]!
                                 [removed]
                                     ISSN: 1533-9289

                                     Today's Topics:

      Re: least favorite/worst              [ Dixonhayes@[removed] ]
      This week in radio history 8-14 May   [ Joe Mackey <joemackey108@[removed] ]
      Re: Worst Shows                       [ ARago17320@[removed] ]
      radio's stinkers                      [ "bcockrum" <rmc44@[removed]; ]
      Least Favorite Radio Program (Again)  [ "Penne Yingling" <bp_ying@[removed] ]
      Lum and Abner                         [ Andrew Steinberg <otrdig1@[removed] ]
      the best                              [ Michael Berger <intercom1@attglobal ]
      least favorite shows                  [ Rutledge Mann <cliff_marsland@yahoo ]
      failing memories                      [ "bcockrum" <rmc44@[removed]; ]
      5-8 births/deaths                     [ Ron Sayles <bogusotr@[removed]; ]
      worst shows ever?                     [ Kermyt Anderson <kermyta@[removed]; ]
      Michael Biel's LOC post               [ "Doug Leary" <doug@[removed]; ]

    ------------------------------

    Date: Sat, 7 May 2005 19:22:42 -0400
    From: Dixonhayes@[removed]
    To: [removed]@[removed]
    Subject:  Re: least favorite/worst
    X-Converted-To-Plain-Text: from multipart/alternative
    X-Converted-To-Plain-Text: Alternative section used was text/plain

    I honestly can't think of a least favorite OTR show.  I know a few that just
    aren't my taste, and some with sub-standard production values that were still
    interesting to listen to ("The Witch's Tale," and a radio adaption I once
    heard of the "Joe Palooka" comic strip).  The ones first mentioned ("Lum and
    Abner," "Amos 'n' Andy," and especially "Vic 'n' Sade") are among my all time
    favorites.

    The only one I *ever* heard that I found painfully bad was "The Jack Webb
    Show," a bizarre attempt at comedy.  Even that was fascinating in its own way,
    like a train wreck.

    Dixon

      *** This message was altered by the server, and may not appear ***
      ***                  as the sender intended.                   ***

    ------------------------------

    Date: Sat, 7 May 2005 22:21:15 -0400
    From: Joe Mackey <joemackey108@[removed];
    To: otrd <[removed]@[removed];
    Subject:  This week in radio history 8-14 May

     From Those Were The Days --

    5/8

    1959 - The final broadcast of One Man's Family was heard on NBC after
    being on the air 27 years. The show had completed 3,256 episodes since
    its beginning in 1932.

    5/9

    1936 - Edgar Bergen and Charlie McCarthy started their own radio show on
    NBC -- only months after they had debuted on Rudy Vallee's program. [removed]
    Fields, Don Ameche and Dorothy Lamour were a few of the stars that
    helped Bergen and the little blockhead, McCarthy, jump to the top of
    radio's hit parade.

    5/10

    1927 - The Hotel Statler in Boston, MA. became the first hotel to
    install radio headsets in each of its 1,300 rooms.

    5/11

    1946 - Jack Barry hosted Juvenile Jury on WOR in New York City. The show
    was such a hit after five weeks on the air that it debuted on the Mutual
    Broadcasting System coast to coast.

    5/12

    1922-- the magazine "Radio Broadcast" commented, "The rate of increase
    in the number who spend at least part of an evening listening to radio
    is almost incomprehensible."

    5/14

    1945 - Tennessee Jed made his debut on ABC. Johnny Thomas played the
    part of Tennessee Jed Sloan.

    Joe

    --
    Visit my homepage:
    [removed]~[removed]  No trees
    were killed in the sending of this message.  However a large number
    of electrons were terribly inconvenienced.

    ------------------------------

    Date: Sat, 7 May 2005 22:21:50 -0400
    From: ARago17320@[removed]
    To: [removed]@[removed]
    Subject:  Re: Worst Shows
    X-Converted-To-Plain-Text: from multipart/alternative
    X-Converted-To-Plain-Text: Alternative section used was text/plain

    This whole area of discussion is a major waste of time for the following
    reasons.

    Some of us are old enough to have heard these shows as children.  Some  have
    been born after OTR died and are coming to OTR as adults or  teenagers.  This
    means that when listening to the shows it is impossible  (yes, I really think
    it is impossible) to judge them by the standards of the  times they were
    broadcast.  We hear them with all the modern thought  patterns we now deal
    with.
    We have been taught to be "Politically Correct"  so our reactions to racial or
    ethnic humor are very different than they were  50-70 years ago.  The same is
    true of women's issues and how their role is  so vastly different today.  All
    the changes in our world and society play  into how we hear things now.  These
    are the reasons I feel you cannot  listen and judge these shows fairly.  You
    cannot compare era's in sports  and you cannot judge entertainment with the
    eyes and ears of the original  hearing.  The opinions are base on data that
    renders them useless  IMHO.

    If people wish to give their opinions, well this is a free country.
    However, these opinions are really, honestly folks, worthless.

    No intent to offend anyone is intended in the above.

    Al Ragonnet

      *** This message was altered by the server, and may not appear ***
      ***                  as the sender intended.                   ***

    ------------------------------

    Date: Sat, 7 May 2005 22:23:03 -0400
    From: "bcockrum" <rmc44@[removed];
    To: <[removed]@[removed];
    Subject:  radio's stinkers

    In my usual penny-pinching way, I bought Radio Spirit's "Old-Time Radio's
    Greatest Westerns" on cassette when the album was recently offered by
    Bargain Books for about $15. I know all sorts of things are considered when
    putting together a collection, but why, oh, why, it was decided that
    Hopalong Cassidy, The Cisco Kid and Red Ryder deserved two cassettes (two
    hours) each, I'll never understand.

    It could be argued that I don't like them because, after all, they were
    kiddie shows. Well, I wasn't too crazy about The Cisco Kid when I was a
    kiddie. I think I heard Hopalong and Red Ryder a few times, but fewer than
    Cisco. And the Ryder shows from 1942 ... why did they choose Reed Hadley
    (based on Dunning) for the part? I've never heard a Westerner refer to
    robbers as "robbuhs" or a beaver as a "beavuh" (as in Little Beavuh).

    As long as they were doing the kiddie stuff, they certainly could have
    thrown in Sgt. Preston,  Wild Bill Hickock, Roy Rogers and Gene Autry. A
    better choice might have been to use the adaptations of Western movies from
    Lux or Screen Guild.

    They gave the Lone Ranger two hours as well; a deserved recognition, because
    of its pioneering and enduring stature ... but why were they all from
    November of 1942 ... why not one with Earle Graser and at least one from the
    late '40s with Fred Foy as the announcer?

    I can't argue with the other sections; two hours each of: Gunsmoke, Have Gun
    Will Travel, Tales of the Texas Rangers, The Six Shooter, Ft. Laaramie and
    Frontier Gentleman. My only caution, as I've mentioned before, don't listen
    to them all at once. Despite the excellent acting and sound effects, there
    is a sameness about them (the voices, the plots, etc.) that can wear you
    down and make you think, gee, they weren't as good as I remember. Of course,
    they are ... spaced a week apart.

    Bob Cockrum

    ------------------------------

    Date: Sat, 7 May 2005 22:23:55 -0400
    From: "Penne Yingling" <bp_ying@[removed];
    To: [removed]@[removed]
    Subject:  Least Favorite Radio Program (Again)

    Seems like we just went through this subject in the recent past.  I do
    believe Ron Sayles is joking, as one lister states. As I recall, it was
    stated that the majority of the population of the US stopped doing what they
    were doing (as I recall) to listen to Amos n' Andy.  I believe the stores
    also closed during the period they were on radio.  Then, again, if 3/4
    listened, there were, I assume, 1/4 that may have agreed with Ron.  As
    stated before, we all have different tastes.  As for my vote, I like all the
    old radio shows.  They sure beat anything that's on today ('cept some of the
    "old" music, of course).  This from old nostalgic Penne.  Good Listenin'!

    ------------------------------

    Date: Sat, 7 May 2005 22:24:27 -0400
    From: Andrew Steinberg <otrdig1@[removed];
    To: [removed]@[removed]
    Subject:  Lum and Abner
    X-Converted-To-Plain-Text: from multipart/alternative
    X-Converted-To-Plain-Text: Alternative section used was text/plain

    Lum and Abner no story? No way. It is all story, but the stories cover weeks
    or [removed] Diogenes Smith storyline went from February 1942 to May 1942,
    advancing humorously for about 10 minutes a show, four shows per week. The
    key is to listen to many of the shows in a storyline. One show by itself may
    not make sense without the larger context.

     No sound effects? Agreed, but who needs sound effects when the writing and
    acting is so perfect. I love this show, especially the period of 1940 to
    1948.

     If I had only one program I could listen to while I drove across the
    country, this would be it.

      *** This message was altered by the server, and may not appear ***
      ***                  as the sender intended.                   ***

    ------------------------------

    Date: Sun, 8 May 2005 07:54:04 -0400
    From: Michael Berger <intercom1@[removed];
    To: [removed]@[removed]
    Subject:  the best

    I know we've done this before, but the variety of OTR
    is so rich that we should create a menu of categories
    in which to rate our 'best 5' [or worst, if we must].
    Here are some suggestions [ in no particular order,
    and with suggested examples of shows, again in no
    particular order of rank or personal preference ]:

    Theatre & Screen [  Campbell Playhouse, Theater Guild,
    Lux Theater, Academy Award Theater, Stars Over
    Hollywood ]

    Ensemble comedy [Jack Benny, Fred Allen, Henry Morgan,
    Al Pearce, Bob Hope, Burns&Allen, Duffy's Tavern, Red
    Skelton, Bergen/McCarthy, etc]

    Family comedy/drama [ Our Miss Brooks, Life of Riley,
    One Man's Family, Gildy, etc ]

    Characters & Couples [ Mayor of the Town, Mel Blanc,
    Harris/Faye, My Friend Irma, Easy Aces, Halls of Ivy,
    Fibber&Molly, Amos 'n Andy, Lum 'n Abner, Vic & Sade,
    etc ]

    Detective [ Sam Spade, Pat Novak, Mr. Keen, Philo
    Vance, Richard Diamond, Philip Marlowe, Boston
    Blackie, Bulldog Drummond, YTJD, Sherlock Holmes, Mr &
    Mrs North, Box 13, Fat Man, Nick Carter, etc]

    Mystery-drama [ Suspense, Gangbusters, Shadow, Escape,
    Lights Out, Whistler, Black Museum, Molle Mystery
    Theatre, True Detective Mysteries, Counterspy,
    Mysterious Traveler, Lineup, Dragnet, Broadway is my
    Beat, Inner Sanctum, House of Mystery, etc]

    Variety [ Command Performance, Royal Gelatin Hour,
    Kraft Music Hall, The Big Show, Birdseye Open House,
    etc]

    American History [ Mr. President, Cavalcade of
    America, Leatherstocking Tales, etc]

    Adventure [ Jungle Jim, Superman, Capt. Midnight, Sky
    King, Terry & Pirates, Adventures by Morse, Jack
    Armstrong, etc ]

    ...and a couple that don't seem to need further
    explanation:
    Quiz
    Western

    Sure that others can improve on this menu but the main
    idea is to provide some categories so that a broader
    spectrum of good shows have a chance to be rated.

    Cheers
    Michael Berger

    ------------------------------

    Date: Sun, 8 May 2005 07:54:12 -0400
    From: Rutledge Mann <cliff_marsland@[removed];
    To: [removed]@[removed]
    Subject:  least favorite shows

    I'd like to nominate:
    -Detectives Black & Blue
    -The Easy Aces
    -Pepper Young's Family
    -anything written by the Hummerts
    -One Man's Family - I love ILAM but this really was
    BAD.
    -I Love Adventure
    -the 1947-8 Ellery Queens where it became a social
    crusade instead of solving mysteries.
    -the serial Amos and Andy
    - an NTR thrown in, the Louis L'Amour Theater- really
    bad production values!
    -Milton Berle show
    -Popeye
    -and throw in 90% of early 1930s syndicated shows.

    *Note, I make the distinction of least favorite and
    bad, some of the shows listed here are plain bad, but
    some I just don't care for because of personal taste.
    While Blackstone the Magic Detective is pretty bad
    (why is it dated 1948 in logs?  the show seems to show
    pretty clearly that iw was made during WWII), I rather
    like it.

    By the way, I've really been digging Rocky Fortune,
    but it doesnt seem to be a very popular show in OTR
    circles.

    [removed] on some of the late Shadows that are hacked up by
    Charles Michaelson syndication, are there any network
    copies floating around?  The Shadow is really hard to
    find in lo-gen past about 1942.

    TC

    ------------------------------

    Date: Sun, 8 May 2005 08:07:00 -0400
    From: "bcockrum" <rmc44@[removed];
    To: <[removed]@[removed];
    Subject:  failing memories

    To underscore w. gary w.'s observation that those involved in shows (even
    their own shows) don't remember the details quite as well as one would
    think, you need only listen to the "Golden Age of Radio" interview playing
    now ([removed]) with Raymond Edward Johnson,
    first host of "Inner Sanctum Mysteries" Not once but twice, aided by the
    host, he recalls the program having started in 1938 rather than when it did,
    1941.

    Bob

    ------------------------------

    Date: Sun, 8 May 2005 12:52:40 -0400
    From: Ron Sayles <bogusotr@[removed];
    To: Olde Tyme Radio List <[removed]@[removed];
    Subject:  5-8 births/deaths

    May 8th births

    05-08-1884 - Harry S Truman - Lamar, MO - d. 12-26-1972
    [removed] president: "Milestones on the Road to Peace"; "World Food Crisis"
    05-08-1895 - Bishop Fulton J. Sheen - El Paso, IL - d. 12-10-1979
    preacher: "Catholic Hour"
    05-08-1899 - Arthur Q. Bryan - Brooklyn, NY - d. 11-30-1959
    actor: George 'Doc' Gamble "Fibber McGee and Molly"; Floyd Munson "Great
    Gildersleeve"
    05-08-1901 - Katherine Raht - Chattanooga, TN - d. 12-2-1983
    actress: Alice Aldrich "Aldrich Family"; Margaret Allen "Against the Storm"
    05-08-1908 - Ted Corday - 7-xx-1966
    director: "A Brighter Tomorrow"; "The Brighter Day"
    05-08-1910 - Mary Lou Williams - Atlanta, GA - d. 5-28-1981
    jazz pianist, composer: "Mildred Bailey Show"; "Andy Kirk and His Clouds of
    Joy"
    05-08-1913 - Sid James - Newcastle, Natal, South Africa - d. 4-26-1976
    comedian: "Hancock's Half Hour"
    05-08-1915 - John Archer (Ralph Bowman) - Lincoln, NE - d. 12-5-1999
    actor: Lamont Cranston/Shadow "The Shadow"; "Gateway to Hollywood"
    05-08-1919 - Lex Barker - Rye, NY - d. 5-11-1973
    actor: "MGM Theatre of the Air"
    05-08-1926 - Don Rickles - NYC
    announcer: "NBC University Theatre of the Air"
    05-08-1928 - John Bennett - London, England - d. 4-11-2005
    actor: "John Bennett Programme"
    05-08-1940 - Ricky Nelson - Teaneck, NJ - d. 12-31-1985
    actor: "Adventures of Ozzie and Harriet"
    05-08-1946 - Candice Bergen - Beverly Hills, CA
    actress: (Daughter of Edgar Bergen) "Edgar Bergen/Charlie McCarthy Show"

    May 8th deaths

    03-24-1928 - Sue Bennett - Indianapolis, IN - d. 5-8-2001
    vocalist: "Your Hit Parade"
    03-28-1903 - Rudolf Serkin - Eger, Bohemia - d. 5-8-1991
    pianist: "Concert Hall"; "New York Philharmonic"
    06-15-1918 - Richard Derr - Norristown, PA - d. 5-8-1992
    actor: "Crime Does Not Pay"
    07-06-1915 - Laverne Andrews - Minneapolis, MN - d. 5-8-1967
    singer: (The Andrews Sisters) "Glenn Miller Orchestra"; "Andrews Sisters Revue:
    07-07-1907 - Robert Heinlein - Butler, MO - d. 5-8-1988
    science fiction writer: "Beyond Tomorrow"; "Dimension X"; "X Minus One"
    09-19-1910 - Margaret Lindsay - Dubuque, IA - d. 5-8-1981
    actress: "Screen Guild Theatre"; "Silver Theatre"
    10-01-1926 - George Peppard - Detroit, MI - d. 5-8-1994
    actor: "MGM Air View"
    10-09-1918 - Skip Farrell - IL - d. 5-8-1962
    actor, singer: "National Barn Dance"
    11-16-1927 - Barbara Payton - Cloquet, MN - d. 5-8-1967
    actress: "Pepsodent Show starring Bob Hope"
    --
    Ron Sayles
    Milwaukee, Wisconsin

    ------------------------------

    Date: Sun, 8 May 2005 13:54:43 -0400
    From: Kermyt Anderson <kermyta@[removed];
    To: [removed]@[removed]
    Subject:  worst shows ever?

    I have to admire Ron Sayles' bravery for setting himself up as a
    whipping boy, even though I disagree with most of his selections. (He
    forgot to mention Bob and Ray -- just two guys talking -- Ron must find
    this even more boring than Vic and Sade, which at least had three.)

    I have to say that a lot of shows that turned me off when I first heard
    them proved eventually to be more palatable when listened to in a
    different context. For example, I've discovered that shows which would
    put me to sleep while driving often turn out to be just perfect for
    listening to at 3 am while trying to get the baby back to sleep. (Over
    the past 7 months I've gained great appreciation for a lot of "slow,
    talky" shows like One Man's Family, Couple Next Door, Lum & Abner, and
    even Superman, which previously sounded very boring and juvenile.) And
    shows that bore me to tears through headphones--like The Green
    Hornet--can be perfect for the car, when I want a little distraction
    but not too much.

    I think the only show I've ever heard that met Ron's criterion of
    something I'd like to purge from my collection is The Blue Beetle.
    Possibly to ultimate combination of wooden acting and wooden
    dialog--even the presence of Frank Lovejoy couldn't same this one.
    However, in six years this might turn out to be my son's favorite show,
    who knows? I've been saving a lot of juvenile series in recent years,
    knowing that the kid is unlikely to leap straight into full-blown
    sophisticated humor and plots, but might enjoy shows that would drive
    me nuts. As several people have commented, there's no accounting for
    taste.

    Kermyt

    ------------------------------

    Date: Sun, 8 May 2005 15:15:04 -0400
    From: "Doug Leary" <doug@[removed];
    To: <[removed]@[removed];
    Subject:  Michael Biel's LOC post

    Thanks to Michael Biel for his informative post. I knew the latest copyright
    extensions went far into the future, but I had no idea they treated sound
    recordings differently from printed material. One thought struck me
    immediately upon reading this passage:

    "ALL PRE-1972 SOUND RECORDINGS WILL REMAIN IN COPYRIGHT IN THE [removed] FOR
    NINETY FIVE YEARS FROM 1972.  For example, cylinders recorded by Columbia in
    1890, and discs recorded by Berliner in 1890, both now claimed by Sony, will
    not go into the public domain in the [removed] until the year 2067 -- a total of
    ONE HUNDRED AND SEVENTY SEVEN YEARS."

    What struck me is that if the same copyright terms had applied to literature
    when Walt Disney was a young man, the Disney empire as we know it would not
    exist today. Mickey Mouse notwithstanding, the foundation of Walt's fortune
    was public domain material from the likes of Mark Twain, Hans Christian
    Anderson and the Brothers Grimm, all of which would have been under
    copyright in the 1930s. Even the earliest edition of Grimms' fairy tales,
    published in 1814, would have been protected until 1991. Nowadays Disney has
    the money to negotiate rights to just about anything they want, but that
    wealth exists because Walt had the freedom to build upon the legacy of the
    past -- a freedom Americans no longer have.

    Doug Leary

    --------------------------------
    End of [removed] Digest V2005 Issue #143
    *********************************************

    Copyright [removed] Communications, York, PA; All Rights Reserved,
      including republication in any form.

    If you enjoy this list, please consider financially supporting it:
       [removed]

    For Help: [removed]@[removed]

    To Unsubscribe: [removed]@[removed]

    To Subscribe: [removed]@[removed]
      or see [removed]

    For Help with the Archive Server, send the command ARCHIVE HELP
      in the SUBJECT of a message to [removed]@[removed]

    To contact the listmaster, mail to listmaster@[removed]

    To Send Mail to the list, simply send to [removed]@[removed]