------------------------------
The Old-Time Radio Digest!
Volume 2003 : Issue 195
A Part of the [removed]!
ISSN: 1533-9289
Today's Topics:
Re: Godfrey on TV [ Mark J Cuccia <mcuccia@[removed]; ]
That time of year [ "steven kostelecky" <skostelecky@ho ]
Network origins (ABC is 50?) [ Mark J Cuccia <mcuccia@[removed]; ]
Old Time Radio on DVD and "The Kille [ Philipmarus@[removed] ]
Re: Arthur Godfrey [ "Andrew Godfrey" <niteowl049@[removed] ]
cold war radio [ "rangus02" <rangus02@[removed]; ]
white bread [ sojax@[removed] (Roger S. Smith) ]
Re: More ABC-TV [ Elizabeth McLeod <lizmcl@[removed] ]
Disbelief [ Harry Bartell <bartell@[removed] ]
re: Bloopers [ John Henley <jhenley@[removed] ]
Why music in comedy shows? [ "David Coursey" <david@[removed]; ]
Rinso . . . Super Suds [ "Candy Jens" <candyj@[removed]; ]
May 13th birthdays [ Ron Sayles <bogusotr@[removed]; ]
Anti-smoking PSA [ "Jim Knaggs" <jknaggs@[removed]; ]
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 12 May 2003 09:14:47 -0400
From: Mark J Cuccia <mcuccia@[removed];
To: [removed]@[removed]
Subject: Re: Godfrey on TV
Larry Jordan wrote:
As a baby boomer, I'm old enough to remember Arthur Godfrey on radio,
but I do not recall him being on TV. I read somewhere that a portion of
his morning CBS radio show was also simulcast on CBS-TV. Is this true?
And if so, when did this start and what years did it cover? Thanks.
This is true, during the 1950's various portions of the CBS Radio weekday
morning "Arthur Godfrey Time" were indeed telecast over the CBS Television
Network. Note that I say various *portions*. It wasn't consistant as to
exactly which 15-minute blocks were simulcast over CBS-TV. In [removed],
when Julius LaRosa was fired, it was at the *VERY END* of the 90-minute
radio program, and the CBS-TV simulcast portions had cut-away about a half
hour earlier. At that time, the 90-min program ran from 10-11:30am Eastern
over the CBS Radio Network, with CBS-TV running 10-11am or *sometimes*
cutting away at 10:55am (I assume for a 5-minute CBS-TV newscast?).
One could always double check old TV Guides or NYTimes TV/Radio listings
(or any other cities' newspaper TV/Radio sections) on microfilm for
further details.
Prior to Summer/Fall 1951, the CBS outcue on both the radio and TV
networks at the end of a program or program "segment" was "This is CBS,
the Columbia Broadcasting System", sometimes with a promo inserted such
as "This is CBS, where 99 million people gather every week, the Columbia
Broadcasting System", or "This is CBS, where Eve Arden holds class as
Our Miss Brooks every Sunday night, the Columbia Broadcasting System" or
the like.
Beginning in the latter part of 1951, the outcue was changed to:
"This is the CBS Radio Network" on CBS Radio;
"This is the CBS Television Network" on CBS-TV (with the new 'eye' logo
popping up).
The tapes or transcriptions I've heard of Godfrey's morning program always
have him closing out with an outcue and local-ID (while Godfrey's theme
"Seems Like Old Times" plays softly underneath), the outcue being "This is
CBS, the Columbia Broadcasting System" prior to Summer/Fall 1951. Since
both CBS Radio and CBS-TV outcued at the end of every program/segment this
way, it didn't matter if Godfrey was simulcasting that 15-minute segment.
But when Summer/Fall 1951 rolled around, how did he outcue? From the tapes
I've heard, he always outcued "This is the CBS Radio Network" after EVERY
15-minute segment, apparantly even if that segment was being simulcast
over the CBS Television Network! I would assume that someone in master
control would cut to a video feed of the 1950's era CBS "eye" (with the
words 'TELEVISION' under 'CBS', and 'NETWORK' under 'TELEVISION', and
backed by "floating clouds") from a printed slide or cue-card.
Godfrey did his *own* network outcues, not his announcer Tony Marvin. Of
course when Godfrey went back to being radio only circa 1960, he let a
*LOT* of people go, including the studio audience as well as Tony Marvin.
(Tony Marvin became a newscaster at Mutual, doing some of their hourly
newscasts in the early 1960s). Godfrey's morning broadcast (now radio
only) during the 1960s began to be trimmed shorter and shorter, although
he pre-recorded shows for *ALL SEVEN* days of the week as the 1960s
continued on. His last programs aired on CBS Radio in April 1972, if I
have my dates correct.
Throughout the 1950s, Godfrey also had some prime-time programs, such as
"Arthur Godfrey's Talent Scouts", and "Arthur Godfrey and His Friends".
At various times during the 1950s, these programs were either CBS-TV ONLY
or they were simulcast over both CBS Radio and CBS-TV. They were all
*LIVE* (except I assume for a west coast kinescope on TV, tape-delay for
Radio, and maybe sometimes a substitute kinescope if he couldn't show up
live?), but I don't really know how the outcues were handled if it was a
simulcast on both CBS Radio and CBS-TV for these prime-time variety
programs of Godfrey's.
BTW, most if not all of the commercials on Godfrey's radio/TV programs in
the 1960s were done *LIVE* by Godfrey, usually demonstrating the product,
so there was no need to "split" the TV and Radio networks when network
commercial positions came up. (Don McNeill's Breakfast Club on ABC Radio
in the 1950's had a few brief periods of time when ABC-TV did a video
simulcast, but I'd read that there were *DIFFERENT* sponsors for the radio
vs. TV portions -- I assume McNeill did the radio commercials LIVE fed
over the ABC Radio Network, while master control ran films of the TV
commercials over ABC-TV).
As far as TV goes, if you've ever seen the A&E/Biography on Godfrey, he
did a few TV specials on CBS-TV in the early 1960s, when he returned to
broadcasting after his surgery for lung cancer in 1959. These variety
specials were pre-taped for the most part. Godfrey also either substituted
for or sometimes co-hosted with Allan Funt on CBS-TV's CANDID CAMERA in
the early 1960's.
He was a paid spokesman for Colgate-Palmolive's Axion Enzyme Detergent in
the late 1960s, doing several voiceover radio commercials and filmed TV
commercials for the product during that time -- I would assume his picture
also appeared in billboard and print (magazine/newspaper) ads for Axion
at the time. I remember him as spokesman for Axion during that time frame!
And he'd occasionally show up as a guest star on someone's TV program
during the 1960s and even 1970s. There is an episode of "The Lucy Show" in
the 1960s, where Godfrey is the guest star *AS HIMSELF*, and Lucy hooks
him to appear in a local stage-play variety show set on a Southern
Riverboat scene.
And in Spring 1978, CBS-TV had their WEEK-LONG "CBS-on-the-Air, a
Celebration of Fifty Years" in [removed] Godfrey (along with Carol
Burnet and Mary Tyler Moore, and I think Lucy as well) were some of the
"primary" hosts for most/all of the seven weeknight broadcasts. One thing
that I remember vividly, was that the first night of broadcast, a Sunday
night, had a LOT of CBS Radio stuff from the 1927-early 50's timeframe,
along with clips of some Sunday night popular CBS-TV shows from previous
years (such as My Favorite Martian, and Jack Benny's TV show).
They had a scene in a 1950's style kitchen, with a plastic table-top radio
and you heard a clip of Godfrey speaking. The camera pans to the living
room, and there is an old B&W 1950's era "furniture cabinet" Television,
and you see the video clip of Godfrey! I caught that right away when I saw
that back in 1978, because even though I was born in 1961 and didn't grow
up with Godfrey in the 1950s, I already *knew* from my always-in-progress
research in old radio/TV/movies/etc., that many of Godfrey's 1950's era
CBS broadcasts were simulcast over both CBS Radio and CBS-TV.
Mark J. Cuccia
mcuccia@[removed]
New Orleans LA
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 12 May 2003 09:15:42 -0400
From: "steven kostelecky" <skostelecky@[removed];
To: [removed]@[removed]
Subject: That time of year
Actually I'm about a month late, but I have gotten the sheckels together to
send a check for $[removed] (suggested contribution) to help keep this Digest
and the Nostalgia Phorums going. As Charlie says, no one has to contribute
anything to receive the Digest, but this is the third year I have done so
and I can't think of a better investment. These endeavors have changed my
life in innumerable ways and have contributed greatly to the furthering of
the hobby and ongoing research and preservation efforts.
Thanks Charlie, and to everyone who contributes to the Digest and Phorums.
Best,
Steve
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 12 May 2003 09:16:03 -0400
From: Mark J Cuccia <mcuccia@[removed];
To: [removed]@[removed]
Subject: Network origins (ABC is 50?)
If you *REALLY* want to trace back the history of ABC, it would in a way
be the second network.
NBC would actually start *BEFORE* 1926, if you count AT&T's WEAF Radio
Network circa 1922. ABC would come around 1924 or so, if you count
RCA/GE/Westinghouse's WJZ Radio Network which had to use inferior Western
Union Telegraph circuits to distribute.
That "might" be stretching it a bit, but the WEAF network did come before
the WJZ network, and WEAF eventually became WNBC/WRCA (now WFAN) but was
NBC-Red for all those years (remaining RCA's NBC after the Blue was sold
to Noble), and WJZ was the key station of NBC-Blue, which was all sold to
Noble and became ABC (Radio).
Sort of "ironic" that WJZ which was originally RCA/GE/Westinghouse's
station and network, was sold off by RCA in 1942/43 to be spun off to
become ABC, while RCA/GE/Westinghouse *bought* WEAF/etc. from AT&T, and
*that* was what was retained as NBC by RCA.
Also "ironic" that Westinghouse (or what remained of them) merged with or
bought out CBS in more recent [removed] of course, today, I think of CBS as
being part of CBS/Viacom/Paramount/Westwood/Infinity/Mutual/NBCRadio/etc.
Of course, CBS has a fixed "origin" of 1927, and Mutual has (had?) a
"fixed" origin of 1934 (or is it 1936?).
But if ABC *REALLY* wanted to go back, it would be to 1924 or so, and
could "claim" to be the second network, after NBC which could claim 1922
as its origins as the first network!
Mark J. Cuccia
mcuccia@[removed]
New Orleans LA
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 12 May 2003 10:45:46 -0400
From: Philipmarus@[removed]
To: [removed]@[removed]
Subject: Old Time Radio on DVD and "The Killers"
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I read Michael C. Gwynne's post concerning Charles McGraw and that diner that
was featured in the film Ernest Hemingway's The Killers (1946) with great
interest. I received a DVD catalog the other day. Upon glancing through it I
noticed that the DVD release of the 1946 classic includes among its special
features the Screen Director's Playhouse version of "The Killers". I have not
"heard" this DVD but would like too very soon.
Sincerely,
Mike Kerezman, Jr
Macomb, Oklahoma
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------------------------------
Date: Mon, 12 May 2003 10:46:03 -0400
From: "Andrew Godfrey" <niteowl049@[removed];
To: [removed]@[removed]
Subject: Re: Arthur Godfrey
Have always been an Arthur Godfrey fan and have been asked more times than
I can remember if I was related to Arthur Godfrey. My dad and Arthur both
lived in New Jersey but no relation.
However, the Julius LaRosa firing is something I really don't understand.
What could he have done
to so infuriate Godfrey to fire him on the air instead of waiting until the
show was over? Being fired is bad enough but to be humiliated on top of the
firing by having it broadcast to the nation makes it even more traumatic.
Andrew Godfrey
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 12 May 2003 11:25:07 -0400
From: "rangus02" <rangus02@[removed];
To: <[removed]@[removed];
Subject: cold war radio
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Paul Feavel's account of the "black" radio stations which were operated during
World War II by both the Germans and the British reminded me of a Cold War
radio situation which prevailed in the Czech Republic well into the 1990s.
Like most other governments during and after WW II, the Czech government
monitored the shortwave broadcasts of the [removed], Britain and other countries
around the world---stations which in most cases they tried to jam to keep
their own citizens from hearing. This work was carried on by Orbis, the media
monopoly which controlled newspapers, radio, television, magazine and book
publishing and just about every other form of mass communications for the 40
years of communist control. The Orbis building on Stalinova housed not only
the editorial offices for various magazines and books, but a mysterious suite
on the second floor which was empty and apparently vacant all day. The rest
of the building emptied at 4:30 every afternoon when the normal work force
went home. At midnight, however, a completely different workforce, mainly
women, streamed into the building, climbed the stairs to the second floor and
sat down at workstations which included shortwave radios and recording
devices, along with steno pads. It was the job of these women to listen to
the various international newscasts including those not in Czech, and
transcribe what they heard. Then, around 4 AM, a supervisor collected the
various transcripts and passed them to an editorial desk where editors decided
which items were important or of interest to government officials, and
produced a daily worksheet containing Czech translations of these items,
intended for distribution only to key personnel at the various government
ministries and bureaus. The workers left the building by 6:30 AM and by the
time the day staff arrived an hour later, there was no evidence of them ever
having been there.
When the Russians moved out after 1989, so did most of Orbis' profitable
divisions, including radio, television, the more popular magazines and
better-selling books. But the women continued to report at midnight each
night until the end of 1997, at which time toe government finally cut off the
funding for the company. As government employees, they couldn't be fired,
even though their entire nightly output was going directly from the typewriter
into the wastebasket. Orbis managing director Jiri Zoufal, well able to read
the handwriting on the wall, tried hard to find a profitable way of using
their labor (one idea was to use the staff to translate genuine government
data on factory and farm production and sell it to the CIA and MI5, later to
media outside the Czech Republic at whatever they could get for it). Even
though no customers showed up, the women kept coming to work right up to
December 31, 1997, when the lights were turned out for the last time.
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------------------------------
Date: Mon, 12 May 2003 11:30:30 -0400
From: sojax@[removed] (Roger S. Smith)
To: [removed]@[removed]
Subject: white bread
Awhile back someone mentioned that white bread was tasteless. Hal Stone
worked for WNEW in Saginaw, Michigan and seeing he was there for a few
years I bet that he would disagree about white bread being tasteless,
that is if he had any Spatz's bread while he was there. Roger
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 12 May 2003 12:24:42 -0400
From: Elizabeth McLeod <lizmcl@[removed];
To: <[removed]@[removed];
Subject: Re: More ABC-TV
On 5/12/03 9:20 AM OldRadio Mailing Lists wrote:
ABC didn't
have many full-time affiliates, but it got its programs out on a lot of
stations. It had The Lone Ranger in 1949, and that got out quite well.
And at the end of 1950, Tom Corbett, Space Cadet switched from CBS to ABC
because ABC was able to give the program a wider distribution. Space
Patrol was an important show before the Paramount merger, as was Super
Circus, which began in the late 40s.
Point taken -- buy in a lot of cases these were examples of extension
spotting by sponsors rather than anything to do with the network. Film
prints of all of these programs were widely distributed to non-ABC
stations by sponsors specifically because ABC itself was so limited in
its reach. With no ABC affiliates available in most markets, this was the
only way these programs could get national distribution.
ABC-TV's ability to service stations on a live basis was severely limited
prior to the UPT merger because its resources were so limited: in fact,
the network was shoved off in a corner of the RCA Building as a tenant
for more than a decade after it was split from NBC, because it couldn't
afford proper facilities of its own. It wasn't until after the UPT merger
that sufficient funds were available to expand ABC-TV into a genuinely
national operation.
Interestingly ABC began its television operations on a very limited basis
during the latter months of the war: as early as 1945 there were "Blue
Network/ABC Television Programs," including a TV version of the popular
daytime audience participation show "Ladies Be Seated." But ABC itself
had no television facilities *at all* at this point -- and it had to
sub-contract all its video production to DuMont. ABC-TV was forced to air
its programs over the DuMont New York station WABD-TV until it finally
got its first television license (for WJZ-TV) in August 1948.
Elizabeth
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 12 May 2003 12:23:32 -0400
From: Harry Bartell <bartell@[removed];
To: <[removed]@[removed];
Subject: Disbelief
Ron Sayles poses an interesting question:
This question is for those of you who have actually worked in Olde Tyme
Radio. When listening to old radio programs, if indeed you do, do you
visualize a horse and rider going off into the sunset, or do you just
see a sound effects man pounding a couple of coconut shells in a box.
Because you have been there and have seen all of the behind the scenes
goings on, is it difficult to suspend disbelief?
While I can speak for only one OTR relic, I would venture to say that the
radio actor would listen to a radio show from many years ago in the same
manner he would view a [removed] it were done well he would not be conscious
of the mechanics. What would probably cause attention to shift would be
things like overly loud or poorly done sound, purple prose and acty
performances. If the old programs were hampered by poor sound recording
that would be the first and most disturbing challenge to a suspension of
disbelief because it immediately calls attention to the mechanics.
Harry Bartell
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 12 May 2003 13:56:26 -0400
From: John Henley <jhenley@[removed];
To: [removed]@[removed]
Subject: re: Bloopers
Andrew Steinberg said,
I was wondering if people could post some of their favorite OTR bloopers.
I mean real bloopers that people have heard in shows, not the ones recreated
years later on records by Kermit Schaefer
Sure, here's my favorite, which I've posted here before but
not in quite a while:
At the very end of a Jimmy Durante Show Christmas episode
guest-starring Margaret O'Brien - don't have the exact date here,
but I believe it was in 1947 - announcer Howard Petrie, absolutely
down to the wire and with the audience applauding behind him,
breathlessly blurts out: "Margaret O'Brien appeared through the
courtesy of Metro-Goldwyn-Mayer producers of the new movie
'Cass Timberlane' starring **Spencie Tracer** and Lana Turner!!"
John Henley
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 12 May 2003 14:27:13 -0400
From: "David Coursey" <david@[removed];
To: <[removed]@[removed];
Subject: Why music in comedy shows?
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Hello:
What was the thinking in including so much music in what today would be
straight-forward situation comedy shows? An example was a Fibber McGee &
Molly where the segment ends and Harlow Wilcox introduced Billy Mills and
the orchestra, who played a song. Or Fred Allen introducing Al Goodman. Or
Dennis Day, who was at least integrated into the program.
When did this trend stop for new programs that came on the air?
Just something I've been wondering about.
--
David E. Coursey, Executive Editor
ZDNet AnchorDesk ([removed] <[removed]; )
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------------------------------
Date: Mon, 12 May 2003 15:15:55 -0400
From: "Candy Jens" <candyj@[removed];
To: <[removed]@[removed];
Subject: Rinso . . . Super Suds
Wasn't the Super Suds, Super [removed] commercial for RINSO ?
Jerry B.
No, Rinso's went:
Rinso white - Rinso bright -
Happy little washday song!
Candy Jens
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 12 May 2003 15:16:37 -0400
From: Ron Sayles <bogusotr@[removed];
To: <[removed]@[removed];
Subject: May 13th birthdays
If you were born on the 13th of May, you share your birthday with:
05-13-1902 - David Broekman - Leiden, The Netherlands- d. 4-1-1958
conductor: "Mobil Magazine"; "Texaco Star Theatre"
05-13-1909 - Ken Darby - Hebron, NE - d. 1-24-1992
singer, choral conductor: (The King’s Men) "Fibber McGee and Molly"
Ron Sayles
Milwaukee, Wisconsin
Hometown of [removed] Kaltenborn
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 12 May 2003 15:17:07 -0400
From: "Jim Knaggs" <jknaggs@[removed];
To: <[removed]@[removed];
Subject: Anti-smoking PSA
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First, I'd like to apologize for this somewhat off-topic question, but this
has been bugging me for years & thought that one of my fellow OTRers might
have an answer.
In the 1970s, I seem to recall an anti-smoking television commercial/PSA
that featured someone dropping a pack of cigarettes and having them swept up
by a gentleman with a broom. This is an odd remembrance from my childhood
that has dogged me for a decades now. I can only remember this scene.
Does anyone remember this PSA? If so, were there any noteworthy actors in
it? Sorry again about the slightly off topic nature -- any insight would be
appreciated.
Jim Knaggs
WCLV [removed] FM Cleveland's Classical Music
WRMR 1420 AM Cleveland's Classic Pops
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End of [removed] Digest V2003 Issue #195
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