Subject: [removed] Digest V2012 #32
From: [removed]@[removed]
Date: 2/17/2012 6:15 PM

To: [removed]@[removed]
Reply-to: [removed]@[removed]

    ------------------------------

                                The Old-Time Radio Digest!
                                  Volume 2012 : Issue 32
                             A Part of the [removed]!
                                 [removed]
                                     ISSN: 1533-9289

                                     Today's Topics:

      Old Time ... Racism?                  [ Derek Tague <thatderek@[removed]; ]
      Racism and OTR                        [ ginger g <gingerbaby2000@[removed]; ]
      Derek Tague & Hal Stone               [ otrguru@[removed] ]
      Stereotypes in OTR                    [ Stephen Donovan <sdonovan06@[removed] ]
      Anti Racism on OTR                    [ "Ryan O" <ryano218@[removed]; ]
      2-16 births/deaths                    [ Ron Sayles <bogusotr@[removed]; ]
      Greatest Entertainer of All Time      [ A Joseph Ross <joe@[removed] ]
      Re: Memories of Hal (Harlan) Stone,   [ Don Shenbarger <donslistmail@sbcglo ]
      The Shadow Scrapbook and Australian   [ Anthony Tollin <sanctumotr@earthlin ]

    ------------------------------

    Date: Fri, 17 Feb 2012 20:10:27 -0500
    From: Derek Tague <thatderek@[removed];
    To: <[removed]@[removed];
    Subject:  Old Time ... Racism?

    I'd just like to agree with my pal Steve Jansen about some of the points in
    the ongoing thread re: racial & sexist stereotypes in [removed]'d like to do this
    by citing animation historians Jerry Beck and Will Freidwald. In the first
    edition of their book "The Warner Brothers Cartoons" from 1981, they speak
    about how certain W-B cartoons were then being diallowed from TV viewings due
    to perceived racist content. These authors suggested that totally suppressing
    decades-old material would be tantamount to denying that racial stereotypes
    ever existed and that denying such is just as racist as anything depicted in
    the objectionable cartoons.

    That's about the size of it,

    Derek Tague

    ------------------------------

    Date: Fri, 17 Feb 2012 20:10:34 -0500
    From: ginger g <gingerbaby2000@[removed];
    To: <[removed]@[removed];
    Subject:  Racism and OTR
    X-Converted-To-Plain-Text: from multipart/alternative
    X-Converted-To-Plain-Text: Alternative section used was text/plain

    Hi all,

    I just had to comment on the Steve Donovan discussion, I'm black
    in my 40's and I've listened to quite a bit of OTR, if the show is funny like
    Duffy's Tavern & Jack [removed] appreciate the humor tremendously. When I hear
    say, Beulah or the Judy Canova show I [removed] then I remember that it's
    history, that was the way it was then. Anyone that wasn't "white" was fair
    [removed] it a comedy show or in a song.  But if you listen to the early 30's
    and the late 40's shows you can hear the difference, which makes you feel
    somewhat hopeful.

    Thanks,
    Sandra

      *** This message was altered by the server, and may not appear ***
      ***                  as the sender intended.                   ***

    ------------------------------

    Date: Fri, 17 Feb 2012 20:10:43 -0500
    From: otrguru@[removed]
    To: DIGEST OLD RADIO <[removed]@[removed];
    Subject:  Derek Tague & Hal Stone

    Derek Tague's Memories of Hal Stone in today's Digest (Vol. 2012-Issue
    30)provided some good recollections about an OTR favorite. I had the
    opportunity to interview Hal Stone for my Those Were The Days program during
    a series of live broadcasts from Scottsdale, [removed] not far from Hal's
    home in Sedona.  That 56 minute conversation with Hal was recorded March 4,
    2006 before a small studio audience.  To hear it, visit my website,
    [removed]  When you get there, click on "Interviews" and scroll
    down to "Stone, Harlan" and enjoy.  -- Chuck Schaden

    ------------------------------

    Date: Fri, 17 Feb 2012 20:10:49 -0500
    From: Stephen Donovan <sdonovan06@[removed];
    To: <[removed]@[removed];
    Subject:  Stereotypes in OTR

    I would like to extend some appreciation to the thoughtful and insightful
    comment that have been posted in response to my topic suggestion. They gave
    me serious food for thought.

    Please do know that it was not my intention to malign the name or works of
    any of anyone's favorite stars. I brought up A&A as an example. Perhaps I
    should have used the term "stereotyped" instead of "racist." Perhaps this is
    splitting hairs. The dialects used in some OTR programs are audio
    caricatures. Some have their basis in long histories of bigotry and hate.
    Amos and Andy was a black-face act which came from vaudeville which came from
    minstrels shows of the Jim Crow South. Caricatures often have the connotation
    of being "lesser than" or inferior in some way. It would also be fair to say
    that calling something cringe-worthy is actually a very subjective statement.
    What bothers me may not bother someone else.

    I very much appreciated the comments about remembering the historical context
    of every program I listen to. Much of what I have heard comes from the 30's
    and 40's. Much of the blatant racist things I have heard come from the 30's
    time period. As examples, I am referring to World Adventurer's Club or Moon
    Over Africa. Non-whites were characterized as fierce savages, faithful
    servants, or evil masterminds. In the 40's, we were at war and the Germans
    and Japanese were demonized. In the 50's, Cold War sensibilities had us at
    odds with the Russians.

    The notion of considering OTR as aural time travel was very helpful. It does
    give us an ear into the sentiment of the times, not unlike reading a period
    book. There are plenty of those in public domain as well and many of these
    were made into radio programs. I am thinking of the Shadow of Fu Manchu as an
    example.

    I do have to wonder why I so rarely see a non-white face at the few OTR
    conventions I have attended. Could it be that it does not have an appeal
    because the non-white characterizations were not so complimentary? Besides
    Charlie Chan or Mr. Moto, can anyone name a major non-white character of any
    series that was not servant, sidekick, stooge, or villain? I could only think
    of singers and perhaps a few sports figures. Then again, I am not as
    knowledgeable as some of you, either.

    I truly do appreciate all of the feedback and please do know that I was not
    trying to offend anyone.
    This discussion is actually quite cathartic to sort out my own thoughts.

    Sincerely,
    Steve Donovan

    ------------------------------

    Date: Fri, 17 Feb 2012 20:12:44 -0500
    From: "Ryan O" <ryano218@[removed];
    To: <[removed]@[removed];
    Subject:  Anti Racism on OTR

    I enjoyed Steve Donovan's comments on the digest the other day. When it
    comes to the listening of classic radio drama, Stephen Jansen expressed it
    best. It really does little good to view it through a modern lens of
    political correctness.

    I am a blind guy and consider myself to be very fortunate to be living in
    the time and place that I am. Many negative stereotypes about blindness
    still exist today, just as racism still exists, but while modern stereotypes
    bother me because I have to deal with them on a personal level, I find it
    very easy to laugh off the blatant and ignorant stereotypes whenever I
    encounter a blind character in a radio story. My rationale is simple. That's
    just the way it was back then and thank God we've come as far as we have.
    Though I am a white guy and may not feel the sting of racism as do other
    minorities, I've encountered my share of ignorant prejudice and know what it
    feels like.

    I can't recall many incidents of overt racism in otr. I know I've heard them
    before on Jack Benny and The Great Gildersleeve. I don't care for Amos and
    Andy so I can't give an informed comment.

    What strikes me as a 21st century listener are the occasional anti-racist
    themes that pop up in various otr dramas. Here is a partial list:

    Escape, under the direction of William N. Robson, dealt with racism and
    prejudice on a semi-regular basis. In, "An Occurrence at Owl Creek Bridge,"
    which takes place during the Civil War, the protagonist, who is a
    Confederate soldier on the run after escaping from a Union hanging,
    encounters one of his freed slaves who taunts him over his bigotry. In,
    "Poison," the main character is a blatant racist living in India. One hot
    night, he is trapped in his bed by a deadly, poisonous snake. He refuses to
    let the local Indian doctor attempt to rescue him at first, calling him a,
    "Gook."

    In, "The fourth Man," three French escaped convicts are stranded on a raft
    in the middle of the ocean waiting for a ship to rescue them. Their pilot is
    an African who speaks no English. Throughout the entire story, the three
    Europeans (criminals all) continually berate the African for his
    inferiority, but in the end, the three Frenchmen kill each other while the
    African survives. In, "Snake Doctor," a bigoted white trash farmer hates a
    black man who sells snake oil for medicinal purposes, but ultimately, his
    hatred costs him his life.

    Two episodes of Gunsmoke come to mind, both with similar themes. "Nina," is
    about an army scout who comes to Dodge with his Mexican wife and is bullied
    by two local townsmen. "Sins of Our Fathers," broadcast about a year later,
    has the same idea, but the two characters are a white mountain man and his
    Native-American wife. Bias against Native-Americans was a common theme on
    Gunsmoke, but "Sunday Supplement," is the only other example that comes to
    mind.

    Fort Laramie also dealt with prejudice against Indians. In, "The Massacre,"
    a religious zealot leads a group of renegades in the slaughter of a peaceful
    Indian tribe. Another good example is, "The Assembly Line," or "Never the
    Twain."

    David Harding, Counterspy features an episode called, "The Case of the
    Poison Peddler," in which a local gangster runs a hate group charged with
    stirring up trouble for minorities.

    Tales of the Texas Rangers features four episodes that I know of that deal
    with themes of racism, either overt or subtle. The best one is, "Cold
    Blood," in which a local white farmer tries to lynch a black man after
    falsely accusing him of murdering his sister. "Paid in Full," features a
    greedy farmer who murders his Mexican share cropper because he'd rather buy
    a new car with money made from chopping cotton than give the Mexican and his
    family their fair share. The scene in which the farmer murders the Mexican
    is particularly powerful as the farmer bellows, "Get back here, you stinkin'
    wetback!" before blasting the fleeing Mexican in the back with a shotgun.
    The other two episodes dealing with racial tensions are, "Pressure," and
    "The Devil's Share."

    Science fiction was always good for allegories on prejudice. Dimension X
    features a story called, "Courtesy," in which a group of space explorers
    catch a plague on an alien planet and are slowly wiped out. In their
    desperation to find a cure, they bully and terrorize the local natives, who
    refuse to give them the answer. Bigotry toward the disabled is even explored
    in, "Universe," where those who are labeled as "mutants" are contained in
    the lower levels of a giant spaceship. Similar themes are explored in,
    "Hello, Tomorrow," and "Pebble in the Sky."

    Of course, the most obvious example of anti-racist rhetoric came from
    radio's superman. Starting in 1946, the man of steel decided to forego the
    usual super villains in favor of the Ku Klux Klan. Bigotry in American
    became a running theme on Superman for the next two years as evidenced by
    such serials as, "Klan of the Fiery Cross," "Drought in Freeville," "Knights
    of the White Carnation," and "The Skin Game." I realize that this was aimed
    at kids as a reaction to World War II. Producers felt that children needed
    to have it drummed into their heads that bigotry and isolationism are bad.
    Still, the pompous, preachy tones don't really do it for me anymore than do
    Aaron Sorkin or Norman Lear today.

    RyanO

    ------------------------------

    Date: Fri, 17 Feb 2012 20:12:50 -0500
    From: Ron Sayles <bogusotr@[removed];
    To: Olde Tyme Radio Digest Digest <[removed]@[removed];
    Subject:  2-16 births/deaths

    February 16th births

    02-16-1884 - Bert Kalmer - NYC - d. 9-17-1947
    lyricist: "You Bet Your Life"
    02-16-1884 - Joe Smith - NYC - d. 2-22-1981
    comedian: (Smith and Dale) "Al Jolson"; "Kate Smith"
    02-16-1893 - Jack Doty - Wisconsin - d. 4-13-1935
    actor: Captain Hughes "Jack Armstrong, the All-American Boy"
    02-16-1893 - Katherine Cornell - Berlin, Germany - d. 6-8-1974
    actor: "Tribute to Ethel Barrymore"; "Victory Clothing Collection"
    02-16-1896 - Alexander Brailowsky - Kiev, Ukriane, Russia - d. 4-25-1976
    pianist: "Music America Loves Best"; "New York Philharmonic"
    02-16-1900 - Albert Hackett - NYC - d. 3-16-1995
    playwright: "Star Spangled Theatre"
    02-16-1901 - Chester Morris - NYC - d. 9-11-1979
    actor: Boston Blackie "Boston Blackie"; Great Merlini "Great Merlini"
    02-16-1902 - Leif Eid - Idaho - d. 3-28-1976
    nbc bureau chief: Washington, Ottawa and Paris
    02-16-1903 - Edgar Bergen - Chicago, IL - d. 9-30-1978
    ventriloquist: "Edgar Bergen/Charlie McCarthy Show"
    02-16-1903 - Norman Shelley - d. 8-22-1980
    actor: John H. Watson "Corner In Crime, Saturday Night Theatre"
    02-16-1904 - George F. Kennan - Milwaukee, WI - d. 3-17-2005
    post world war two diplomat: "Meet the Press"
    02-16-1904 - James Baskett - Indianapolis, IN - d. 7-9-1948
    actor: Gabby Gibson "Amos 'n' Andy"
    02-16-1905 - Carleton D. Smith - d. 4-27-1984
    announcer/executive: "Fireside Chat with FDR"
    02-16-1909 - Hugh Beaumont - Lawrence, KS - d. 5-14-1982
    actor: Appeared on radio in 1931
    02-16-1909 - Jeffrey Lynn - Auburn, MA - d. 11-24-1995
    actor: "Keep 'Em Rolling"; "Gulf Stream Guild Theatre"
    02-16-1910 - Jerry Lester - Chicago, IL - d. 3-23-1995
    comedian: "The Jerry Lester Show"; "Kraft Music Hall"
    02-16-1911 - Hal Porter - Thornbury, Australia - d. 9-29-1984
    writer: "The Forger"
    02-16-1911 - "Curly" Noland - Tennessee - d. 1-16-1993
    bass: "The Swift Jewel Cowboys"
    02-16-1912 - Del Sharbutt - Ft. Worth, TX - d. 4-26-2002
    announcer: "Hobby Lobby"; "Jack Benny Program"; "Victory Theatre"
    02-16-1914 - Jimmy Wakely - Mineola, AR - d. 9-23-1982
    country singer: "All-Star Western Theatre"; "Hollywood Barn Dance"
    02-16-1915 - Carlotta Dale - Ardmore, PA - d. 12-1-1988
    vocalist: "Music for Moderns"; "Rhapsody in Rhythm"
    02-16-1915 - Dorothy Lovett - Providence, RI - d. 4-28-1998
    actor: Libby Collins "Lux Radio Theatre"
    02-16-1915 - Leah Ray - Norfolk, VA - d. 5-27-1999
    vocalist: (The Phil Harris Band) "Tommy Riggs and Betty Lou"
    02-16-1917 - George Neise - Chicago, IL - d. 4-14-1996
    actor: "The Judy Canova Show"; "The Man Called X"
    02-16-1918 - Patty Andrews - Mound, MN
    singer (Andrews Sisters) "Andrews Sisters Revue"
    02-16-1918 - Win Blake - d. 8-4-2003
    disk jockey: WKXL Concord, New Hampshire
    02-16-1921 - Frances Rickett - Covington, KY - d. 8-6-2008
    writer: "Family Theatre"; "Al Goodman's Musical Album"
    02-16-1921 - Norman Swallow - Eccles, England - d. 12-5-2000
    producer: "Speaking Personally"
    02-16-1921 - Wayne Howell - d. 7-8-1993
    announcer, disc jockey: "Chamber Music Chamber Society of Lower Basin
    Street"
    02-16-1922 - Robert Campbell - Detroit, MI - d. 5-xx-1981
    announcer: "Out of the Deep"
    02-16-1926 - Vera-Ellen - Cincinnati, OH - d. 8-30-1981
    actor: "Martin and Lewis Show"; "Tony Awards"; "Bud's Bandwagon"
    02-16-1928 - Desmond Cory - Lancing, Sussex, England - d. 1-xx-2001
    Script writer for the BBC
    02-16-1932 - Gretchen Wyler - Bartlesville, OK - d. 5-27-2007
    singer-actor: "Sounds of Freedom"
    02-16-1933 - Rod Trongard - d. 7-16-2005
    announcer: Minnesota radio
    02-16-1937 - Gary Barkdoll - d. 6-16-2001
    disk jockey: WAYZ Waynesboro, Pennsylvania

    February 16th deaths01-06-1934 - Bobby Lord - Sanford, FL - d. 2-16-2008
    country music artist: "Country Music Time"
    01-19-1932 - George Mann MacBeth - Lanarkshire, Scotland - d. 2-16-1992
    poet, producer: BBC Radio
    02-09-1912 - Bob Hannon - Chicago, IL - d. 2-16-1993
    singer: "American Melody Hour"; "Waltz Time"
    02-17-1906 - Virginia Mansfield - Covington, KY - d. 2-16-2001
    singer: "Andy and Virginia"; "Turn Back the Clock"
    03-10-1918 - Gloria Stewart - d. 2-16-1994
    actor: (Wife of James Stewart) "Lux Radio Theatre"
    03-18-1911 - Smiley Burnette - Summum, IL - d. 2-16-1967
    host, comedian: "Smiley Burnette Show"; "Hollywood Hotel"
    04-12-1914 - Ken Williams - Canada - d. 2-16-1984
    actor: Brian Wells "David Harum"
    04-21-1933 - Jim Harmon - Mount Carmel, IL - d. 2-16-2010
    author: "The Great Radio Heroes"
    05-04-1909 - Howard Da Silva - Cleveland, OH - d. 2-16-1986
    actor: "Lux Radio Theatre"; "Forecast"; "Suspense"
    07-03-1920 - Louise Allbritton - Oklahoma City, OK - d. 2-16-1979
    actor: "Screen Guild Theatre"; "This Is My Best"; "Cavalcade of America"
    08-01-1912 - Ronnie Kemper - Missoula, MT - d. 2-16-1997
    bandleader: "Ronnie Kemper"; "Horace Heidt Orchestra"
    08-03-1911 - Ken Patterson - Montana - d. 2-16-1990
    actor: "Dragnet"
    08-29-1904 - Ronald Watkins - Surrey, England - d. 2-16-2001
    Reader of prose and poetry
    09-29-1907 - Richard Harkness - Artesian, SD - d. 2-16-1977
    newscaster: NBC network, occassionally filled in for [removed] Kaltenborn
    11-30-1915 - Brownie McGhee - Knoxville, TN - d. 2-16-1996
    blues guitarist, singer: "New World A' Coming"; "This Is Jazz)

    Ron

    ------------------------------

    Date: Fri, 17 Feb 2012 20:13:42 -0500
    From: A Joseph Ross <joe@[removed];
    To: [removed]@[removed]
    Subject:  Greatest Entertainer of All Time

>     Date: Wed, 15 Feb 2012 00:06:37 -0500
>     From: Al Girard<24agirard24@[removed];

>     ...
>     I was astounded when "the people" voted Tom Hanks as the greatest
>     entertainer of all time.

    Several years ago, someone on this forum asked who the best comic of all
    time was.  Someone (I believe Laura Leff) pointed out that it's hard to
    answer that because we only have a record of entertainers of the past
    century or so when sound recordings, and later motion pictures, became
    available.

    I then responded about Groucho Ben Nun, Joshua's younger brother, who
    kept everyone laughing in the Israelite camp.  They say he did great
    Moses imitations.

    --
    A. Joseph Ross, [removed]                     [removed]
    92 State Street, Suite 700          Fax: [removed]
    Boston, MA 02109-2004     [removed]

    ------------------------------

    Date: Fri, 17 Feb 2012 20:14:09 -0500
    From: Don Shenbarger <donslistmail@[removed];
    To: [removed]@[removed]
    Subject:  Re: Memories of Hal (Harlan) Stone, 1931-2007

    On 2/15/2012 Ian Grieve wrote:

>     5 Years, didn't think it was that long. I wish I had met you in person
>     Hal.

    I agree with all of that. And I do so miss his thoughtful comments on
    this board.

    Don Shenbarger

    ------------------------------

    Date: Fri, 17 Feb 2012 20:15:14 -0500
    From: Anthony Tollin <sanctumotr@[removed];
    To: <[removed]@[removed];
    Subject:  The Shadow Scrapbook and Australian & Brazilian
     Shadow broadcasts

    on 2/15/12 11:18 PM, Ian Grieve wrote:

>     Anthony Tollin, I enjoyed your Shadow Scrapbook, I am no expert on The
>     Shadow and you have just educated me and a lot of other folks on what
>     questions still need answers.

    Actually, THE SHADOW SCRAPBOOK wasn't my book. My late friend Walter Gibson,
    who created the character of Lamont Cranston and wrote 283 of the Shadow
    pulp novels, authored the majority of the book. I'm very honored that he
    enlisted me to help him on HIS book!

    My favorite chapters of THE SHADOW SCRAPBOOK aren't the ones I personally
    wrote, but Walter's own first-person accounts of the development of THE
    SHADOW MAGAZINE and his legendary pulp crimebuster, the creation of The
    Shadow's Lamont Cranston alter ego, the introduction of the Dark Avenger's
    true identity of aviator Kent Allard and the Mutual radio revival. Walter
    wrote from his own memories, enhanced by the daily diary entries he always
    maintained except during the dozen-year period when he was pounding out two
    or three Shadow novels each month. In Walter's explanations of the events he
    personally lived, we get a richer, more human picture of those times, and
    also how he worked with scriptwriter Edward Hale Bierstadt on the 1937 radio
    relaunch.

    There will be a revised and expanded edition of THE SHADOW SCRAPBOOK coming
    out next year, commemorating the 50th anniversary of the 1963 Shadow
    paperback and radio revival. Walter's portions will be largely unchanged,
    though enhanced by some other articles he wrote on The Shadow, a lot more
    vintage photos and some new sidebars. And of course my radio chapters will
    be substantially revised and expanded (for example, correcting the omission
    of Margot Stevenson and the 1935 MacGregor & Sollie syndicated series
    starring Carl Kroenke, and listing all 26 episodes of the 1938 Goodrich
    summer series). I also didn't have photos of Shadow illustrators like Tom
    Lovell, Edd Cartier, Bob Powell and the Rozen brothers when THE SHADOW
    SCRAPBOOK was published in 1979, nor images of James La Curto, Orson Welles
    or Bill Johnstone costumed as The Shadow.

    BTW, Ian, I was very happy to read your informative chapter on Grace
    Gibson's Australian Shadow series in Martin's book, which considerably
    expanded our understanding of the Australian series. (I'd been especially
    curious to learn who voiced the evil Shadow doppelganger in "The Shadow
    Challenged," the role Frank Readick returned to enact in the American
    version.) Lloyd Lamble died just a couple years ago, and it's a shame nobody
    thought to do a full-fledged interview with the last surviving Shadow from
    the Golden Age of Radio. Or was he? Is Richard Ashley, the second Australian
    Lamont Cranston still alive?

    BTW, if anyone on the list is curious to know what the opening of the
    Brazilian SHADOW series sounded like (in Portuguese!), it can be heard on my
    website at:

    [removed]

    --Anthony Tollin (in the shadows)

    --------------------------------
    End of [removed] Digest V2012 Issue #32
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