Subject: [removed] Digest V2003 #441
From: <[removed]@[removed]>
Date: 12/10/2003 9:22 PM

To: <[removed]@[removed];

    ------------------------------

                                The Old-Time Radio Digest!
                                  Volume 2003 : Issue 441
                             A Part of the [removed]!
                                     ISSN: 1533-9289

                                     Today's Topics:

      #OldRadio IRC Chat this Thursday Nig  [ lois@[removed] ]
      BBC Archive                           [ "Austotr" <austotr@[removed]; ]
      Locutional Considerations             [ "Stephen A Kallis, Jr." <skallisjr@ ]
      On The Air, by John Dunning           [ John Francis MacEachern <JohnFMac@c ]
      the light [removed]                    [ "[removed]" <[removed]@[removed] ]
      Any Vagabonds Today?                  [ "Derek Tague" <derek@[removed]; ]
      Re: "naughty" words                   [ hal stone <dualxtwo@[removed]; ]
      Family Theatre: A Daddy for Christma  [ "Andrew Godfrey" <niteowl049@[removed] ]
      "Ask Your Doctor"                     [ "RBB" <oldradio@[removed]; ]
      role sharing                          [ Kermyt Anderson <kermyta@[removed]; ]
      Big Sale! on OTR Radio Shows on CD    [ John DOrazio <ventureqwest@[removed] ]
      E-book about OTR                      [ "Philip Chavin" <philchav@[removed] ]
      CD Jewell Cases                       [ "Scott Rogers" <srogerssprint5@eart ]
      RE: Easter Sunday                     [ Michael DeMeo <demeom@[removed] ]
      Two Front Teeth                       [ Dick Backus <backus2@[removed]; ]
      Mysterious Traveler                   [ "Harry Machin Jr" <harbev5@earthlin ]
      12-11 births/deaths                   [ Ron Sayles <bogusotr@[removed]; ]
      Marie confusion                       [ Ron Sayles <bogusotr@[removed]; ]
      Perry Mason/ sedate detective         [ Allen Wilcox <aawjca@[removed]; ]

    ------------------------------

    Date: Wed, 10 Dec 2003 03:36:00 -0500
    From: lois@[removed]
    To: [removed]@[removed]
    Subject:  #OldRadio IRC Chat this Thursday Night!

    A weekly [removed]

    For the best in OTR Chat, join IRC (Internet Relay Chat), StarLink-IRC
    Network, the channel name is #OldRadio.  We meet Thursdays at 8 PM Eastern
    and go on, and on! The oldest OTR Chat Channel, it has been in existence
    over six years, same time, same channel!

    Our numerous "regulars" include one of the busiest "golden years" actors in
    Hollywood; a sound man from the same era who worked many of the top
    Hollywood shows; a New York actor famed for his roles in "Let's Pretend" and
    "Archie Andrews;" owners of some of the best OTR sites on the Web;
    maintainer of the best-known OTR Digest (we all know who he is)..........

    and Me

    Lois Culver
    KWLK Longview Washington (Mutual) 1941-1944)
    KFI Los Angeles (NBC) 1944 - 1950
    and widow of actor Howard Culver

    (For more info, contact lois@[removed])

    ------------------------------

    Date: Wed, 10 Dec 2003 10:12:57 -0500
    From: "Austotr" <austotr@[removed];
    To: <[removed]@[removed];
    Subject:  BBC Archive

    In issue 440 David Rogers discussed Archives.

>     1 - Why does there seem to be a reluctance to release "short run" releases
>     of limited interest shows? Either TV or radio?  If people want stuff and are
>     willing to pay for it and it is lying there earning no money while it sits
>     on the [removed] you see what I mean?

>     2 - This brings me to a second point about many universities etc that hold
>     archive material and there is limited access to stuff.  Radio (and TV) is
>     broadcast material.  I can understand limited access so that stuff does not
>     get damaged, however, to protect people from hearing it and (God forbid)
>     copying it, seems to deny what such material is - broadcast material.

    David I really want to understand this as well.  Not only on the earning
    potential but on the access.  Why do archives store for future generations
    but restrict access?  My teenagers are a future generation since archives
    were started, but where is their access to the material.  It seems access is
    deliberately restricted to researchers rather than interested people.
    Perhaps they are storing for storage sake and access was never planned.
    Dossier on Dumetrius is a 104 ep series in mp3 as well as audio circulation
    and is very popular.  If the average Australian walked into Screensound and
    asked for a copy of Dossier, the cost is $10,000.  I have donated copies of
    my transcriptions to Screensound, I have another 200 or so CDs ready to go
    to them.  If you want a copy from them, those are the sort of costs they
    will hit you for.  I do not understand it.  They get requests from people
    wanting a particular episode of a variety show because a relative was on it,
    but they generally get fobbed off and the requests come to the collectors.
    While I am crooked on Screensound, I can't blame the people there, they
    abide by the rules.  I see the sense in having an archive, hence I support
    it, but the designers or rulemakers of some archives need to think about
    what it is all about.  That then is the community's responsibility to tell
    them how we want our resources to be used.

    Sure Copyright is an issue, instructions of the donors are an issue and
    understandable, but with Australia the squeezing of funding to Screensound
    is putting everything at risk and is of great concern.  Again, a community
    responsibility.

    Some months ago I advised of the release of Air Adventures of Biggles, those
    who rushed out and ordered got a goldmine because the series was removed
    from sale.  Not because of copyright issues as we first thought, but because
    the Capt [removed] Johns Estate decided that because Capt Johns indicated that he
    was unhappy about the series, because a girl was introduced as a member of
    the cast, that they would honour his memory by making sure the series was
    removed from sale.  Screensound was forced by the courts to destroy the
    unsold copies.  To me, common sense should show that Capt Johns would be
    unlikely to hold such a view in this day and age, so why force that decision
    now?  Oh, and why was there a girl in the Biggles team?  The sponsors
    insisted that it be so :)  So here was Screensound trying to do the right
    thing and kicked badly in the process.  That release was their biggest
    seller to date, which showed that the community liked the release.

    Ian Grieve
    Australian OTR Group

    ------------------------------

    Date: Wed, 10 Dec 2003 10:13:39 -0500
    From: "Stephen A Kallis, Jr." <skallisjr@[removed];
    To: [removed]@[removed]
    Subject:  Locutional Considerations

    Chris Holm, speaking of "cussin'," notes,

>     consider the person who types something like "bulls***", as if those
>     three asterisks somehow make itbetter.  If you choose not to swear,
>     that's fine and I respect that.  If you choose to swear, that's fine and
>     I respect that too.  But to do something silly like replacing a few
>     letters with asterisks deserves no respect.

    Me and Rodney Dangerfield!  As one who asterisked certain words a couple
    of Digests back, I was following and will continue to follow the practice
    that was established in national newspapers such as The New York Times,
    The Wall Street Journal, and the like.

    There was once a story of a blind man who carried a lantern at night.
    When someone told him how silly that was, he responded, "I don't carry
    this for me; I carry it for you."

    There are many on the distribution list who are contemporaries to the
    programs we're discussing.  Many of them know the words in question, but
    are less than happy to see them spelled out.  That is why the asterisks:
    not to be clever, but for those whom it might offend if the words were
    spelled out.

    Stephen A. Kallis, Jr.

    ------------------------------

    Date: Wed, 10 Dec 2003 10:14:21 -0500
    From: John Francis MacEachern <JohnFMac@[removed];
    To: OTR Digest <[removed]@[removed];
    Subject:  On The Air,  by John Dunning

    Hi!

    If anyone on the Digest wants, but can't afford a copy of this book,
    drop me a note and I'll send it to you, free.  This particular copy is
    in terrible condition;  however it's perfectly readable from title page
    to the index, complete.

    A little background:  I bought the book last April as a birthday present
    to myself.  I'm a foster Dad for sick and injured animals;  through the
    local clinic, I take them in for a few days or  weeks until they are
    healthy again.  Well, I had this mean tempered dog for a couple of days
    a few months ago.  He decided to make the book his chew toy and damaged
    it badly (all within the three minutes I was out of the room).  I
    ordered a new copy and it arrived today.  I was going to throw out the
    old one, but then thought of making this offer.

    Every important page of the book is intact and readable, it has no front
    cover and lots of teeth marks, it's not a pretty sight, but it's still
    quite usable and if anyone wanted to take the time to cover it like we
    did in grade school, it probably wouldn't look that bad either.

    As I mentioned, it's for free to anyone, especially those who couldn't
    otherwise afford it.  The first response gets it.  If after a couple of
    days there are no responses, it'll be in the trash.

    E-mail me privately.

    John Mac

    ------------------------------

    Date: Wed, 10 Dec 2003 10:14:38 -0500
    From: "[removed]" <[removed]@[removed];
    To: <[removed]@[removed];
    Subject:  the light [removed]

    In #440, Michael Biel wrote:

>     Chris is very confused with Ted's reference to flocking a
>     Christmas tree because painting and flocking are two entirely
>     different things.  <SNIP - ANSWER CONTINUES>

    This is what's great about this list.  No matter what kind of question I
    have, somebody is here with an answer.  But even more than that, there are
    people who can put that answer into context.  Thanks!

    -chris holm

    ------------------------------

    Date: Wed, 10 Dec 2003 10:15:59 -0500
    From: "Derek Tague" <derek@[removed];
    To: <[removed]@[removed];
    Subject:  Any Vagabonds Today?
    X-Converted-To-Plain-Text: from multipart/alternative
    X-Converted-To-Plain-Text: Alternative section used was text/plain

    HI GANG:

          In the on-going thread re: "grey-area" language emanating over the
    1930s air-waves, the esteemed historian Elizabeth McLeod concluded  her
    posting with:

>     This put the fear of you-know-who into broadcasters, and language was
>     bleached Rinso White for the rest of the radio era (although you might
>     still hear a "hell" if someone sang 'Song of the Vagabonds.')

    Is "Song of the Vagabonds" the one that starts "Oh ye sons of [removed]," goes
    on to exhort its listeners to fight the Burgundians, and concludes with "And
    to HELL with Burgundy!"?

        If so, then this'll help me out. I never really knew the title to this
    anthem. It sounds like it was written by Victor Herbert or Sigmund Romburg,
    or one of those guys. I once saw and heard Jim Nabors sing it on an episode
    of "Gomer Pyle." So if anybody ever asks you if the clean-cut character of
    Gomer Pyle ever used the word "hell" during the course of the show, you've
    got him [Nabors/Pyle  also once sang "The Impossible Dream" which, of course,
    has the line "to be willing to march into Hell for a heavenly cause."].

        Oh, BTW, the seldom-aired TV Christmas cartoon classic "Mister Magoo's
    Christmas Carol" airs on the Caroon Network tonight (Wed. 12/10).  It
    features voices by OTR vets like Jim Backus (natch!), Les Tremayne, June
    Foray, Paul Frees, and the interim TV Lone Ranger John Hart  I have to give
    this TV-film points for offering what is probably one of the most honest,
    down-to-earth credits I've ever seen "Freely Adapted from Dickens' 'A
    Christmas Carol.'"  That's right up there with THE TAMING OF THE SHREW "by
    William Shakespeare; additional dialogue by Sam Taylor." Enjoy!

    Yours in the "wreath"-er!

    Derek Tague

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    ------------------------------

    Date: Wed, 10 Dec 2003 10:16:11 -0500
    From: hal stone <dualxtwo@[removed];
    To: <[removed]@[removed];
    Subject:  Re: "naughty" words

    I think I may have told this story a few years back. Holy Mackerel,
    (expletive deleted), has it been two years since I became a Digest
    participant?)

    Incidentally, for what it's worth, on the "Archie" program, Jugheads
    favorite exclamation was "gee Whiz". Had the NBC censors known that to
    "Wizz" (Pronounced the same) was in common usage having to do with writing
    one's name in the snow, we'd all have been in big trouble.

    Anyway, I digress. That's not the tale I once posted to the Digest, and will
    now retell for the Newbies among you.

    On one "Archie Andrews" episode, Archie and Jughead were in the process of
    re-painting the Andrews house. Naturally, all sorts of complications and
    mishaps occurred, culmination with Jughead stepping into a bucket of paint,
    tripping, falling, resulting in a SFX of a horrendous crash and clatter.

    What follows is the script, as near as I can recall.

    BETTY:   (excitedly) Oh dear, what was that?

    ARCHIE:  (Yelling) Jughead! What happened?

    JUGHEAD: (Sheepishly, and loudly) I put my foot in a bucket of paint.

    In the heat and excitement that we were all supposed to covey at this messy
    accident, without looking at the script, I instead "wailed" my line, quite
    innocently and accidentally.

    "I put my F--k in a bucket of paint."

    Now, why didn't I get fired by NBC immediately? Because I was one lucky SOB.
    As it turned out, this episode was done during  the period when I was in the
    Air Force during the Korean War, and temporarily stationed at an Air base in
    New Hampshire. I would arrange to get a weekly pass to travel back to New
    York, and we (FORTUNATELY) were taping the show for my convenience.

    After the cast picked themselves up off the floor, (a condition that
    resulted from shock and laughing so hard), and order was restored about 15
    minutes later, we simple did a pick up from Archie's lead in line, and
    continued taping the rest of the show. But I was beet red from embarrassment
    to put it mildly.

    Hal(Harlan)Stone
    Jughead

    ------------------------------

    Date: Wed, 10 Dec 2003 10:17:38 -0500
    From: "Andrew Godfrey" <niteowl049@[removed];
    To: [removed]@[removed]
    Subject:  Family Theatre: A Daddy for Christmas

      If anyone on the list is looking for a heartwarming OTR Christmas story
    listen to A Daddy for Christmas broadcast of 12-15-48 of Family Theatre.
    Shirley Temple is the host and I think this is one of the best Christmas
    shows I have heard on OTR so far. The show runs 24 minutes so will not take
    up a lot of time.
      To hear Shirley Temple talking about the power of prayer reminds me that
    today if a star came out in public for prayer like that they probably would
    be put on some kind of blacklist. Activist groups against public prayer
    today would be up in arms and be taking someone to court if a show like that
    was made today.
       That is why OTR is such an oasis in a world that has turned it's back on
    Christian values. Family Theatre is not talked about much in OTR groups but
    I think it represents everything good about OTR and how back then it was not
    cool to make fun of organized religion like it is today.
       I have listened to over 400 OTR shows this year and have not once heard
    any profanity. You can't say that about radio or TV today.
       Wish more people knew about Family Theatre as it consistently had shows
    that touch the heart of the listeners.
        Andrew Godfrey

    ------------------------------

    Date: Wed, 10 Dec 2003 10:21:46 -0500
    From: "RBB" <oldradio@[removed];
    To: <[removed]@[removed];
    Subject:  "Ask Your Doctor"

    Listening to some old commercials recently, especially noting all of the
    copywriting for medical products and the announcers always say "...ask your
    Pharmacist if XXX is right for you!"    The cigarette commercials, however,
    were endorsed by "Doctors."

    Today, the TV ads instruct you to "see your Doctor" (...as if it's simple to
    make a phone call or an appointment just to chat with a doctor) to ask about
    a new drug perscription.

    The old commercials were correct, it's still easier to see the Pharmacist to
    inquire about a new product, and there's that confidential, courtesy counter
    for a chat.

    Happy Holidays to the list!

    Russ Butler  oldradio@[removed]

    ------------------------------

    Date: Wed, 10 Dec 2003 11:31:54 -0500
    From: Kermyt Anderson <kermyta@[removed];
    To: [removed]@[removed]
    Subject:  role sharing

    I was interested to note that Una Merkel and Marie
    Wilson (NOT Windsor, as incorrectly stated) almost
    share a birthday. These two actresses also shared a
    role with Lurene Tuttle (Una and Marie on the silver
    screen, Lurene on radio). Can anybody name the role?

    12-10-1903 - Una Merkel - Covington, KY - d. 1-2-1986
    actress: Adeline Fairchild "Great Gildersleeve";

    12-11-1922 - Marie Windsor - Marysvale, UT - d.
    12-10-2000 actress: Irma Peterson "My Friend Irma"

    Actually, I just double-checked the IMDB, and it is
    indeed Marie Windsor who was born on Dec 10, not Marie
    Wilson (who was born 8/19/16). Marie Wilson, however,
    is the one who played Irma on "My Friend Irma." Marie
    Windsor is best known for gritty noir roles--about as
    far from Marie Wilson's character as one could
    get--and apart from appearing in one episode of
    Suspense ("Script by Mark Brady", 3/22/59), I don't
    know of any other OTR work by her.

    Kermyt

    ------------------------------

    Date: Wed, 10 Dec 2003 11:32:03 -0500
    From: John DOrazio <ventureqwest@[removed];
    To: [removed]@[removed]
    Subject:  Big Sale! on OTR Radio Shows on CD
    X-Converted-To-Plain-Text: from multipart/alternative
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    Run,don't walk to COSTCO ! They are selling BELOW WHOLESALE !
    Radiospirits 20 CD Sets,which sell for $[removed] per set. At COSTCO
    $[removed] You have to be a member to get in the club. But if you have a
    friend,you can get in with their card. Also call your club near you !
    because some states may not stock [removed] in New Jersey they do.
    WOW ! what a deal !  Treat yourself to a great Christmas Gift !
                                            Merry Christmas !  John D'Orazio

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    ------------------------------

    Date: Wed, 10 Dec 2003 11:33:04 -0500
    From: "Philip Chavin" <philchav@[removed];
    To: [removed]@[removed]
    Subject:  E-book about OTR

        Twenty Questions was a popular radio quiz program running from 1946 to
    1954.
    One of the original panelists (1946--1949) has written a book titled "The
    Twenty Questions Radio Show".  Although it's written as a novel, it's based
    on his actual experiences on the show.  It's available as a downloaded
    e-book or as a CD-ROM, either priced at only $[removed], on [removed].
    On the left side of that home page, under Authors, you select Bob
    VanDeventer, then clicking "Buy Now" (the top one) will give info on the
    book.

        I have no commercial connections with the author or Stonegarden and am
    simply posting this for any Digesters who might be interested in reading
    about the OTR experiences of a radio performer, etc.

      -- Phil C.

    ------------------------------

    Date: Wed, 10 Dec 2003 11:49:09 -0500
    From: "Scott Rogers" <srogerssprint5@[removed];
    To: <[removed]@[removed];
    Subject:  CD Jewell Cases
    X-Converted-To-Plain-Text: from multipart/alternative
    X-Converted-To-Plain-Text: Alternative section used was text/plain

    I was at OfficeMax this morning and they were selling 100 slim CD jewell cases
    for $[removed] The rebate for these is $[removed]  Free is a pretty good price.

      *** This message was altered by the server, and may not appear ***
      ***                  as the sender intended.                   ***

    [ADMINISTRIVIA: You can get some _really_ good rebate deals at OfficeMax, so
    long as you're willing to birddog the submission. I picked up a quarter-gig
    of RAM for the servers for $10 after rebate, and a free CD-RW drive. But plan
    on tracking and possibly contacting them regarding the status of your rebate,
    since frequently things get "lost." Photocopy your submission materials so
    you have evidence.  --cfs3]

    ------------------------------

    Date: Wed, 10 Dec 2003 15:59:42 -0500
    From: Michael DeMeo <demeom@[removed];
    To: [removed]@[removed]
    Subject:  RE: Easter Sunday

    Martin Grams,Jr. asked

>     Does anyone know if April 6, 1941 or April 13, 1941 was Easter Sunday?
>     I know it's one of those two dates but can't figure out which one.

    Hello
    	Easter Sunday is calculated by the Christian Church as falling on
    	The first Sunday;
    	After the first full moon;
    	After the first day of [removed]

    So, the full moon was on Friday, April 11, 1941, my guess is
    April 13, 1941 as Easter Sunday.

    ------------------------------

    Date: Wed, 10 Dec 2003 15:59:54 -0500
    From: Dick Backus <backus2@[removed];
    To: [removed]@[removed]
    Subject:  Two Front Teeth

       Can anyone suggest where I might find a program on which "All I Want for
    Christmas is My Two Front Teeth" was performed. It seems to me one of the
    Godfrey shows or Spike Jones may have had it, but I can't remember.
       Thanks,
                                                                            Dick
    Backusl

    ------------------------------

    Date: Wed, 10 Dec 2003 16:00:13 -0500
    From: "Harry Machin Jr" <harbev5@[removed];
    To: "Old Time Radio Digest" <[removed]@[removed];
    Subject:  Mysterious Traveler

    Will the person who responded to my question about
    The Mysterious Traveler please reply to me again?
    I accidentally deleted your email.
    Thanks,
    Harry

    ------------------------------

    Date: Wed, 10 Dec 2003 16:00:19 -0500
    From: Ron Sayles <bogusotr@[removed];
    To: Olde Tyme Radio List <[removed]@[removed];
    Subject:  12-11 births/deaths

    December 11th births

    12-11-1886 - Victor McLaglen - Tunbridge Wells, England - d. 11-7-1959
    actor: Captain Flagg "Captain Flagg and Sergeant Quirt"; Mountie Eric Lewis
    "Red Trails"
    12-11-1894 - Eddie Dowling - Woonsocket, RI - d. 2-18-1976
    host: "We, the People"; "Ziegfeld Follies of the Air"

    December 11th deaths

    02-20-1906 - Richard Himber - Newark, NJ -  d. 12-11-1966
    bandleader: "Studebaker Champions"; "Your Hit Parade"
    04-25-1921 - Robert Q. Lewis - NYC - d. 12-11-1991
    disc jockey, comedian, host: "Arthur Godrey Time"; "Robert Q. Lewis Show"
    09-11-1909 - Anne Seymour - NYC - d. 12-11-1988
    actress: "Mary Marlin "Story of Mary Marlin"; Francie Nolan "Tree Grows in
    Brooklyn"

    Ron Sayles
    Milwaukee, Wisconsin

    ------------------------------

    Date: Wed, 10 Dec 2003 23:21:20 -0500
    From: Ron Sayles <bogusotr@[removed];
    To: Olde Tyme Radio List <[removed]@[removed];
    Subject:  Marie confusion

    It seems as though I got my Maries confused on the birth/death list.

    Marie Wilson was born on 8-19-1916 in Anaheim, CA and died on 11-23-1972

    Marie Windsor was born on 12-11-1919 in Marysville, UT and died on 12-10-2000

    Sorry for the confusion.

    Ron Sayles
    Milwaukee, Wisconsin

    ------------------------------

    Date: Wed, 10 Dec 2003 23:21:43 -0500
    From: Allen Wilcox <aawjca@[removed];
    To: [removed]@[removed]
    Subject:  Perry Mason/ sedate detective

    On the subject of sedate detectives one must consider
    Perry Mason. Now granted that the radio version was a
    soap opera and that his occupation is an attorney. One
    consed that Perry at times did some sleuthing and had
    his detective buddy Paul Drake doing the leg work. But
    it was Perry's uncanny ability to put all the clues
    together for the final climax of the stories.
    Would it not have been great to have Raymund Burr as
    the radio voice of Mr. Mason!
    Allen

    --------------------------------
    End of [removed] Digest V2003 Issue #441
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