Subject: [removed] Digest V2012 #31
From: [removed]@[removed]
Date: 2/15/2012 10:18 PM

To: [removed]@[removed]
Reply-to: [removed]@[removed]

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                                The Old-Time Radio Digest!
                                  Volume 2012 : Issue 31
                             A Part of the [removed]!
                                 [removed]
                                     ISSN: 1533-9289

                                     Today's Topics:

      #OldRadio IRC Chat this Thursday Nig  [ charlie@[removed] ]
      Memories of Hal (Harlan) Stone, 1931  [ "Ian Grieve" <austotr@[removed] ]
      re: Racism and otr                    [ rand@[removed] ]
      The Shadow                            [ "Ian Grieve" <austotr@[removed] ]
      Re: Harlan Stone                      [ "Bob Scherago" <scherago@[removed] ]

    ------------------------------

    Date: Wed, 15 Feb 2012 02:12:01 -0500
    From: charlie@[removed]
    To: [removed]@[removed]
    Subject:  #OldRadio IRC Chat this Thursday Night!

    A weekly [removed]

    For the best in OTR Chat, join IRC (Internet Relay Chat), StarLink-IRC
    Network, the channel name is #OldRadio.  We meet Thursdays at 8 PM Eastern
    and go on, and on! The oldest OTR Chat Channel, it has been in existence
    over nine years, same time, same channel! Started by Lois Culver, widow
    of actor Howard Culver, this is the place to be on Thursday night for
    real-time OTR talk!

    Our "regulars" include OTR actors, soundmen, collectors, listeners, and
    others interested in enjoying OTR from points all over the world. Discussions
    range from favorite shows to almost anything else under the sun (sometimes
    it's hard for us to stay on-topic)...but even if it isn't always focused,
    it's always a good time!

    For more info, contact charlie@[removed]. We hope to see you there, this
    week and every week!

    ------------------------------

    Date: Wed, 15 Feb 2012 13:26:01 -0500
    From: "Ian Grieve" <austotr@[removed];
    To: <[removed]@[removed];
    Subject:  Memories of Hal (Harlan) Stone, 1931-2007

    In issue 30 Derek Tague took the time to remind us of Hal Stone.  One of my
    biggest regrets in OTR is that I didn't visit FOTR when Hal was there.  I
    intended to, but kept putting it off.  I loved sparing with him and Dereks
    kind words about Hal brought it all back.  "Awesome Aussie", he wrote that
    inside his book for me and it meant a [removed] me.  What an education I was
    given between Hal and others throwing in terms like "pearl diving in a
    diner" to descibe doing the dishes, I learnt a lot.  5 Years, didn't think
    it was that long.  I wish I had met you in person Hal.

    Ian Grieve

    ------------------------------

    Date: Wed, 15 Feb 2012 13:26:07 -0500
    From: rand@[removed]
    To: [removed]@[removed]
    Subject:  re: Racism and otr

    I'll throw in my two cents about racism in otr.

    As others have mentioned, otr is a reflection of its time, just like any
    other popular culture artifact.  Watch and old movie from the 30s or 40s,
    and you find just as much casual racism, sexism and stereotyping - Blacks
    as porters, "exotic" Asians, Irish cops, women stuck in particular roles,
    etc.

    Do I feel guilty watching old movies or listening to old radio shows?
    Absolutely not.

    As a historian of the era, I can accept the material for what it is and
    look at other aspects of the characters, the story, or the craftsmanship
    that went into creating it.  It's not unlike looking at books like
    "Huckleberry Finn" in the context of their times and recognizing the
    artistry of Mark Twain as an author.

    I do have difficulty sitting through some otr or movies of the period that
    are so relentless in racism or stereotypes in their subject matter.  As a
    collector of more "odd" radio transcriptions, I've run into plenty of
    shows that were probably outdated in their views on minorities when they
    were originally broadcast and practically unbearable today.  (You can
    explore them at my blog, [removed] .)

    One is "Southland Echoes", a strange show recorded for syndication in 1947
    and distributed in the south and some rural markets.  It's a strange mix -
    southern gospel quartet songs, music by a group of yodeling sisters, and a
    Blackface comedy team that sounds like a throwback to the 1920s.  I
    listened to it once to dub and restore it to digital, but couldn't stomach
    any more than that - it says a great deal about the different attitudes
    towards Blacks in the South as late as 1947.  (And says something about
    the stir created just a few years later when Elvis and other singers
    combined "race" music with country to create early rock n' roll or we saw
    the emergence of the early civil rights movement in the south.)

    Another was quite painful to restore - the only surviving episode of
    "Plantation Echoes", a circa 1930 Transco syndicated series, featuring a
    Black cast performing a play taking place on an "Old South" plantation,
    singing spirituals and creating a stereotyped picture of slave life that
    would make "Gone with the Wind" look like "Guess Who's Coming to Dinner?"
    That disc was accidentally shattered when it was sent to me in the mail -
    I had to spend many hours transferring it to digital and piecing it back
    together.

    Then there's "Uncle Remus", featuring white performer Jimmie Scribner
    performing all the roles in the famous stories in a syndicated series in
    the 1940s.  The series is historically important, coming out about the
    same time as the Disney film and you're amazed at Scribner's talent, but
    the racism and stereotyping is tough to swallow.

    I'll note that these discs are no longer in my collection - I donated them
    to the Special Collections Library at Duke, along with several other
    transcriptions that have a great deal of historical value.  While I might
    get out one of my AFRS or lacer transcriptions of "Suspense" or many other
    shows and play the original once in a while and enjoy it, these are shows
    I'll probably never listen to again.  I don't "enjoy" them as much as I
    found them interesting as artifacts of their time that need to be
    preserved.

    I'll leave you with a couple of more thoughts on the matter that are very
    personal.

    As a Gay man and a filmmaker that has made documentary features on Gay
    subjects, I'm always interested in the occasional, off-hand references to
    homosexuality and gay stereotypes in otr and films that are occasionally
    found in early 30s radio shows and pre-Code movies - one of Fred Allen's
    "Linit Bath Club" shows or the original early 30s Warner Brothers
    production of "The Maltese Falcon" are examples.

    I can stomach this casual stereotyping of that era more than I can the
    relentless stereotyping of Gays and Lesbians I see in current LGBT films,
    Sirius/XM's gay radio channel, or sitcoms on network television like "Will
    and Grace".

    I'm a Gay man that would rather watch a good action movie than listen to
    the excruciating lisping announcers and dance music on Sirius/XM's Out-Q
    or sit through the campy comedies and perfect Ambercrombie and Fitch
    models featured in some idyllic urban Gay existence in an LGBT film fest.
    I find it all just as embarrassing as 1930s Blackface.

    So, if you look around you at popular culture, you'll see cultural and
    racial stereotypes still out there today.  But, is it any better that
    minorities themselves are perpetuating their own stereotypes?  Isn't any
    book, radio show, record or film just a reflection of the time in which it
    was created?

    rand

    ------------------------------

    Date: Wed, 15 Feb 2012 13:26:36 -0500
    From: "Ian Grieve" <austotr@[removed];
    To: <[removed]@[removed];
    Subject:  The Shadow

    There has been a lot of talk about accuracy in regard to The Shadow.  But
    nobody has mentioned the biggest mistake of all in Martin's book of The
    Shadow.  I mean to say, whats a few issues of Love Story and who said what
    and who actually did it, in comparison to mistakes the size of continents.
    Page 762, paragraph 4, line 3.  South America instead of South Australia.
    How could a mistake like that slip through?  Probably because I didn't
    notice it.  My apologies and I am sure it will be replaced by an even bigger
    mistake next time :)

    I have The Shadow Scrapbook and I have Martin's book.  Martin's book is too
    big and I haven't read it all yet.  I have read the Scrapbook and enjoyed it
    and didn't notice any errors.  I have read Appendix D in Martin's book and
    spotted the glaring error.  However, Martin's book did have that little bit
    about The Shadow in Australia which has reduced a lot of email I used to get
    asking me about that little known show.  Little known in Australia anyway,
    but certainly the first show I was always asked about in correspondence from
    the [removed]  I am thankful that someone, starting with Roy Bright, wanted the
    Australian story told factually.  Apart from that huge mistake of course :)

    I have never written a book.  I am part way through working on a couple, but
    I couldn't imagine the effort that goes into compiling a book like Martin
    Grams, The Shadow and keeping all the facts straight and in the right order
    etc.  That is a massive book with a massive amount of information and if
    there are [removed] and I am sure there is more than the one I know [removed]
    well, we will just have to look forward to another edition, in bigger print
    as I will need it by then.

    Anthony Tollin, I enjoyed your Shadow Scrapbook, I am no expert on The
    Shadow and you have just educated me and a lot of other folks on what
    questions still need answers.  I bet a lot more people are going to be
    looking for the answers now and that is only going to be a good thing.  Its
    good to know what it is that we don't know.  When it comes to writing a book
    on research, there are going to be a lot of different styles and some folk
    will differ on accuracy and what the criterior is for including information
    unconfirmed by documentation.  It doesn't make one way right or wrong and I
    agree that people's recollections are important, accurate or not, they
    become a part of the story, but they might not fit every style of book or
    style of author.

    Ian Grieve

    ------------------------------

    Date: Wed, 15 Feb 2012 13:29:19 -0500
    From: "Bob Scherago" <scherago@[removed];
    To: <[removed]@[removed];
    Subject:  Re: Harlan Stone

>     From: Derek Tague <thatderek@[removed];
>     Next week marks the fifth anniversary of the passing of the man I call the
>     "Patron Saint of the Old Time Radio Digest." Hal Stone died unexpectedly
>     from post-surgical complications on February 21, 2007.

    It's incredible to believe that Jughead died nearly five years ago. I used
    to enjoy his posts to this list, and really enjoyed reading his book, but
    more than that, I enjoyed the personal communication from him when I ordered
    his book. He was a gentleman, and I know he's missed by all the listers here
    who remember him.

    --------------------------------
    End of [removed] Digest V2012 Issue #31
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