------------------------------

[removed] Digest				Volume 96 : Issue 409

Table Of Contents: 

	 What's Funny
	 The Great Man
	 Gale Gordon
	 Holy Mackeral, Andy!
	 random coments and a question or 2
	 21st FOTR Con Photos [removed]
	 New Shadow Documentary
	 War of the Worlds
	 Remembrance of Things Past
	 C120s
	 Re: AMOS 'N' ANDY

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 24 Oct 1996 12:45:17 -0400
From: Bigkids@[removed]
To: [removed]@[removed]
Subject: What's Funny
Message-ID: <961024124517_132009124@[removed]>

The discussion of "Amos 'n' Andy" bubbles up every so often, doesn't it? I
think it's just the most prominent example of ethnic humor that we have these
days, and it keeps coming up because the show was so incredibly popular in
its day, and people look back at it and get stirred up.

Remember, friends, that ethnic humor used to be all the rage. I remember
receiving a joke book (not a comic book, understand -- this was a huge,
multi-hundred-page volume, containing just page after page after page of
jokes) when I was about 12 years old, and the book being divided into
sections:

Colored jokes

Scottish jokes

Irish jokes

Italian jokes

Jewish jokes

Mother-in-law-jokes

Golf jokes

Hillbilly jokes

Fat, Skinny, Blind and Deaf jokes

Lawyer jokes

Doctor jokes

Honeymoon jokes

Kid jokes

Fisherman jokes

Preacher jokes

. . . and so on. I suppose the idea was, anybody putting together a luncheon
speech for the local Rotary or Kiwanis Club could use the joke book as a
reference source, and pepper his speech with jokes of the appropriate (or
inappropriate) sort.

Ethnic humor is considered Politically Incorrect these days, although it is
far from extinct. This morning's Oakland Tribune contains a joke, attributed
to an African American standup comic:

"I feel sorry for white people -- they're the only ones abducted by UFO's."

Obviously, this comedian has never heard of Barney Hill, but what the hell
boss what the hell it's still a mildly funny line.

To get back to A&A -- I think the main basis for objections is not the ethnic
stereotyping (or at least, not solely that) but the fact that the show was
created, the scripts were written, and the on-mike actors were all white.
[removed], Gosden and Correl (pardon me if I misspelled those names). If blacks
had done it, they would probably have received far less criticism.

In a way, this makes the "UFO" joke all the more notable. It would have been
less so, if the comedian had said, "I feel lucky being black, the UFO people
never abduct any of us." But he didn't choose to do it that way.

By the way -- and then I'll get off the subject of A&A -- does anybody know
if any "Sam 'n' Henry" shows survive? This program was the forerunner of A&A,
and by all reports was every bit as funny if not funnier. The name change
came about as the result of a copyright dispute, or so I've been told. It
would be fascinating to hear the S&H version.

---------------

In a broader sense, our idea of what's funny changes with the passage of
time. Pardon me if I've made this point before, but a couple of examples come
to mind -- Danny Kaye and Jerry Lewis. Both of them were considered hilarious
in their respective heydays, but when I see their old films nowadays, I am
baffled.

Most of their shticks are . . . just not funny. 

And I find myself wondering, Was Danny Kaye really funny in 1948? Was Jerry
Lewis really funny in 1958? Or were we (the public) fooled into thinking they
were funny, by massive Hollywood hype?

Of course, there are some contemporary comedians who effect me the same way.
I look at Steve Martin and I think, This man is just not funny. What's going
on here? (Actually, *some* of Martin's material is funny, and his performance
is definitely skillful. I just think some of his mugging and desperate
struggles to *be* funny, are merely pathetic -- even embarrassing.)

But, what the hell boss what the hell these guys became rich and famous, they
must have been doing something right.

On the other hand, some period humor just holds up beautifully. Including a
*lot* of old-time radio humor! A few years ago during one of my sporadic
Hollywood jaunts, I found myself on a movie set, chatting between takes with
Jeremy Piven. The subject was, What is the funniest line in the history of
comedy?

After considerable discussion, we reached consensus. The funniest line in the
history of comedy is the moment of dead silence between "I said, Your money
or your life!" and Jack Benny's response, "I'm thinking, I'm thinking."

How old is that shtick? Fifty years at least, right? If not more? Anybody
know the date Benny first used it?

Dick Lupoff

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 24 Oct 1996 12:47:29 -0400
From: PDKinder@[removed]
To: [removed]@[removed]
Subject: The Great Man
Message-ID: <961024124727_1381326814@[removed]>

Dick Lupoff is right about this movie.  It's a small gem, a real masterwork
by a lot of actors virtually forgotten today.  Julie London even does a nice
turn as the great man's mistress.  

Yes, it's dark, but the ending affirms one's faith in the integrity and
fairness of radio journalists.  Mel Ferrer does an excellent job as the
Murrow-type reporter.

For anyone who's not seen Ed Wynn act, this movie will be a revelation.  I
haven't seen it in years, but I can recall vividly the station owner of WGHP
in Springfield, Mass., talking about how he'd been betrayed after giving the
great man his first break.  WGHP:  With God's Help, Peace.  And in the 50s.
 Wow!  It's easy to focus on Wynn, but watch the Ferrer-Wynn interaction.

I first saw this picture when I was in my early teens.  I recall my mother
telling me it was based on Arthur Godfrey.  Anybody know if that's true?  In
later years, I've heard the name of a prominent newsreader of the time
associated with it, but since I can't imagine he was the shmuck portrayed,
I'm not going to mention his name.

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 24 Oct 1996 10:14:41 -0700 (PDT)
From: Charles Ulrich <culrich@[removed]>
To: [removed]@[removed]
Subject: Gale Gordon
Message-ID: <[removed]@[removed]>
Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII

Another TV show on which Gale Gordon appeared was Dennis the Menace. The
original Mr. Wilson (George) was played by Joseph Kearns, known to OTR
fans from The Mel Blanc Show, among others. When Kearns died, George
Wilson moved away and his brother John Wilson moved in. Gale Gordon played
John Wilson.

--Charles

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 24 Oct 1996 11:49:15 -0600
From: Chet Cox <CHCOX@[removed]>
To: [removed]@[removed]
Subject: Holy Mackeral, Andy!
Message-Id: <[removed]@[removed]>

I may be the only person who doesn't find most Amos & Andy shows
funny.  Am a BIG fan of the character of Amos and guess I can't
"forgive" Kingfish for taking his place in the series.  Guess I just knew
too many characters like George (Kingfish) Stevens in real life (though
"my" Kingfishes were always white) to find them funny in fiction.  Amos
was a fully realized, three-dimensional, courageous, LIKABLE character
-- an everyday hero, if you will.  His rise from poor farmhand (the
migration to the city slums was no joke!) to struggling taxi driver and
family head is teriffic Horation Algier stuff -- I don't hesitate to describe
Amos as a successful man.

Like A. Tollin, I HIGHLY recommend the book *the Adventures of Amos &
Andy* which gives a good rendition not only on how effective and
popular the show was, but on how it may very well have been a major
catalyst in the social changes we saw -- and are still seeing.  It gives a
good background on "Sam & Henry," A&A's predecessor (of which I
have only ONE episode, and it's lousy).

The Christmas Show (evidently EVERY Christmas show) on A&A is still
one of the prime examples of well-done schmaltz, and I highly
recommend each OTR collector should have ONE of them in their
collection.  Amos is featured heavily in this story, as he recites and
explains the Lord's Prayer to his daughter -- and a more touching
definition of the "all men are created equal" concept you'll never hear this
side of Thomas Jefferson.

The TV show (which I BARELY remember) seemed to return to
spotlighting Amos more than the later (after Amos & Ruby married) radio
shows did.  A shame it didn't last (NAACP pressure didn't really faze the
networks, but the ratings just weren't enough to justify the hassle.), as
Alvin Chambers (if I remember the actor's name correctly) made an
outstanding Amos.  Even the Kingfish seemed to gain a bit more humanity
in this version.

Still, for suspense, humor, and pathos - nothing beats the very early
Amos & Andy.  Ignore the winded minstrel-show routines (which even
Abbott & Costello couldn't save when THEY used them on radio) and
listen to a show about relationships between friends and sweethearts.

*jeep!
~~~~Chet
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Quote of the day:  "Thanks to automatic teller machines, we no longer
have to tell children that money doesn't grow on trees.  They now think
it comes out of a wall."  --Loretta V. Swisher

------------------------------

Date: 24 Oct 1996 14:02:24 CST
From: [removed]@[removed]
To: otr@[removed]
Subject: random coments and a question or 2
Message-Id: <m0vGUue-000k4lC@[removed]>

Hi all:
First I'd like to say thanks to those who told of the goings on at
the "fot Convention. I found it very interesting. So interesting that I
am going to try to get to Cincinati. I am blind so I'll have my wife
point me in the general direction and hope I find it. hahaha. Second,
the 2 shows that got me started in OTR were the Jack Benny show and Amos
'n Andy. If I had to pick only 2 shows to take to a desert island,
they'd still be the 2 I'd pick. I don't care if it's "pc" or not to like
A 'n A., in fact when I first heard it I didn't know they were played by
white guys.
third, I was listening to the "chicken heart" skit from Lights Out and
wondering if there was more than one version of it. boy! It sure seems
silly now, or was it ment to?
Lastly I have been enjoying the digest so mutch since I first subscribed
to it I was curious about the growth in subscribers. Is the list growing
as mutch as it seems to be?
Whew!! I'm all out of breath now. "Thank God." all the rest of the
digesters said.

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 24 Oct 1996 16:59:17 -0400
From: Charlie Summers <charlie@[removed]>
To: [removed]@[removed]
Subject: 21st FOTR Con Photos [removed]
Message-Id: <v03007800ae9588446a3b@[[removed]]>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"

Afternoon, folks!

   The first of the photos from the 1996 FOTR Con came in this morning, and
I got a few on-line at:

[removed]

   (Please be kind; I am not a professional photographer, and am not real
great with 1600-speed film. When more of the photos show up, I'll
reorganize into seperate pages to help with load times.)

   If I get some time over the weekend, I'll try to get some of the sound
files up. (I came back to a lot more work than I [removed])

   Public thanks to Jay Hickerson and the entire committee for throwing one
heck of a three-day party!

         Charlie Summers

 ----------------------------------------------------------------------
 [removed] Communications                               charlie@[removed]
          Management Information Solutions for the Real World.
                        [removed]

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 24 Oct 1996 14:52:29 -0700
From: Dennis De Marco <dennisdm@[removed]>
To: [removed]@[removed]
Subject: New Shadow Documentary
Message-Id: <[removed]@[removed]>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"

I've been listening to the new Shadow documentary from Anthony Tollin. It's
really a great tape. My question: There's a sound bite on there of The
Shadow hosting a show from the early 30s. In this clip, The Shadow just
relates the story (I think) but doesn't paiticipate. Does anyone know if
this is a recreation or the real thing? If it's real, do entire shows like
this exist? Also, what is the earliest complete Shadow in existence?

Thanks,

Dennis

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 24 Oct 1996 19:14:01 -0400
From: Jim Widner <jwidner@[removed]>
To: [removed]@[removed]
Subject: War of the Worlds
Message-Id: <[removed]@[removed]>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"

>Air.'' And from 10 >[removed] to midnight Sunday, Amari will premiere a digitally
>restored and remastered >version of Orson Welles' 1938 classic ``The War of
>the Worlds'' along with >``Suspense.''
>

And you can get that same digitally remastered show in the
Smithsonian/Radio Spirits copy of Old Time Radio: Science Fiction available
at major bookstores and I am sure via Radio Spirits as well as via Anthony
Tollin, who is on this digest.


-----------------------------------------------------------------------
Jim Widner                      INTERNET: jwidner@[removed]
Dayton, OH                      WWW: [removed]


                                                 

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 24 Oct 1996 18:34:58 -0500 (CDT)
From: Rhiman Rotz--IU Northwest <rrotz@[removed]>
To: otr@[removed]
Subject: Remembrance of Things Past
Message-Id: <[removed]@[removed]>
Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII

	Dan Hughes seemed disappointed that 15% of his class
had never heard of Jack Benny.  Why aren't you elated that
85% of the class *had* heard of him?  Try the same class on
major historical figures -- OK, not Washington or Lincoln,
but I wouldn't be the least bit surprised if that's more than
had heard of, say, Franklin Delano Roosevelt.  (Can you guess
that I teach history?)
	On a more somber note, I was disappointed to once again
see the sentiment expressed that African-Americans who object
to rebroadcasts of Amos & Andy are just being thin-skinned.  
Racism has, unfortunately, been such a powerful force for so
long in this country that I just don't think it's appropriate
to parallel "Colored" stereotyping, as it was then called, with
ethnic jokes about the Irish or Jews.  There's lots of evidence
that black people experienced unpleasantness several quantum 
leaps above other groups (there wasn't, for example, regular and
persistent lynching of Irishmen).  In any case, I'm always
reluctant to tell someone else what shouldn't offend them when
I haven't shared their situation, and I think that ought to
apply double here.  I bought commercial Amos & Andy tapes to
find out what I thought of the show, and I would encourage
others who are curious to do likewise.  I'm white, which
means I don't know what it's like to be black in this country,
which means I'm not going to take it on myself to tell
African-Americans what they should and shouldn't be offended by.
	[[removed] -- I laughed a *lot* at the tapes.]  

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 24 Oct 1996 18:05:25 -0700 (PDT)
From: ronhare@[removed] (Ron Hare)
To: otr@[removed]
Subject: C120s
Message-Id: <v02130504ae94e6121584@[[removed]]>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"

I must rise to the defense of C120s again, I guess.

Blatantly ignoring the paranoia surrounding the thinner tape, both my wife
and I have C120s playing in our car cassette machines most of our driving
hours. Over the span of more than 5 years (and about 15 cars with various
brands of tape and cassette players) I can recall only two tangles. And one
of these tangles was a C60 that apparently had slack on insertion.

This may be the key - we are careful to remove slack when inserting any
length cassette into any machine. My assumption that this is standard
practice may be the reason my experience is different from others.

Also, VHS HIFI problems are not expected to occur with only a few machines.
It's a delicate process using such a small portion of that half-inch tape
that any monor error anywhere is likely to bite you in the future.
Archivists don't like the odds. Reel-to-reel is best, but it is cumbersome.
BTW, the lower speed on VHS HIFI yields almost identical audio results. The
odds of an error are higher, but not by much.

The 8mm tape audio format is far better even though the tape is narrower.
In a good deck, the process is PCM and 1/6 of the helical scan is devoted
to stereo audio. Tracking is automatic also. A format far more robust than
VHS. This is a big reason for the popularity of 8mm camcorders over VHS
ones.

Ron Hare
ronhare@[removed]

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 24 Oct 1996 21:32:52 -0400
From: SanctumOTR@[removed]
To: [removed]@[removed]
Subject: Re: AMOS 'N' ANDY
Message-ID: <961024213251_1146715587@[removed]>

Regarding Tom Barnett's defense of AMOS 'N' ANDY:  Lamont Wilson of SANFORD
AND SON shouldn't be throwing stones at AMOS 'N' ANDY since the gags on the
latter were not about race.    No one on AMOS 'N' ANDY ever made comments
about any race that were in any way similar to Redd Fox's frequent and
derogatory laugh-getting line "ugly white woman."  Racism runs both ways and
Gosden and Correll (who had grown up in the South with Black friends) NEVER
would have used that kind of derogatory racial comment.  Their humor was
ethnic dialect humor, not Redd Fox's demeaning racial quips. -- Anthony
Tollin 




--------------------------------
End of [removed] Digest V96 Issue #409
*******************************************

