Subject: [removed] Digest V2002 #365
From: "OldRadio Mailing Lists" <[removed]@[removed];
Date: 9/20/2002 3:03 PM

To: <[removed]@[removed];

    ------------------------------

                                The Old-Time Radio Digest!
                                  Volume 2002 : Issue 365
                             A Part of the [removed]!
                                     ISSN: 1533-9289

                                     Today's Topics:

      Waltons and 70's OTR fandom           [ Ivan G Shreve Jr <iscreve@[removed] ]
      Quiz answer                           [ Ivan G Shreve Jr <iscreve@[removed] ]
      20 questions                          [ "alanladdsr" <alanladdsr@[removed] ]
      Re: CASS-CD                           [ Fred Berney <berney@[removed]; ]
      William Johnstone                     [ "alanladdsr" <alanladdsr@[removed] ]
      Answer to mini-quiz                   [ "Philip Chavin" <philchav@[removed] ]
      20 Van Deventers?                     [ leemunsick@[removed] ]
      MOST OVER RATED OTR SHOWS             [ Ruk77@[removed] ]
      A way to recover Lost shows???        [ Ruk77@[removed] ]
      Ranger answers                        [ "joe@[removed]" <sergei01@earthli ]
      Rehearsals                            [ Harry Bartell <bartell@[removed] ]
      Classical Music                       [ "Stephen A Kallis, Jr." <skallisjr@ ]
      The world's Greatest OTR              [ Zharold138@[removed] ]
      Re: CBS -- In The Beginning           [ Elizabeth McLeod <lizmcl@[removed] ]
      AN INTERVIEW WITH GOD                 [ Sandy Singer <sinatradj@[removed]; ]

    ------------------------------

    Date: Thu, 19 Sep 2002 18:19:03 -0400
    From: Ivan G Shreve Jr <iscreve@[removed];
    To: Old Time Radio Mailing List <[removed]@[removed];
    Subject:  Waltons and 70's OTR fandom

    Derek Tague wrote, in an incredibly well-written post:

>     Recently, if I find myself home on week-end afternoons, I sometimes turn
>     to reruns of "The Waltons" on TVLand. I never really appreciated this show
>     when it was first on. It debuted in 1972, when I was in 5th Grade, & no
>     self-respecting boy in my school would belittle himself to watch it simply
>     because in my school, "The Waltons" with all that corny "Good night,
>     John-Boy," stuff was considered a "girl's show."

    My family pretty much watched "The Waltons" from the get-go--but my father
    wasn't a very big fan, as I recall.  He was irritated by the fact that the
    Waltons were supposed to depict a poor Depression-era family, when in fact
    they were much better off than his family during those times.  (I chuckle
    because I can remember him yelling at the TV set: "You people aren't poor!
    You have your own BUSINESS!  Look at the piece of land you own,
    ferchrissakes!")

    Setting that aside, I agree wholeheartedly with Derek's post--the 70's were
    a great era for OTR, due no doubt to the nostaliga boom at that particular
    period of time.  I look back fondly at those old Radiola and Mark 56
    releases and I've probably spent a good fortune at eBay filling in whatever
    gaps remain in my collection of those wonderful LPs.

    Ivan
    --
    "I know I'm [removed] as long as I make 'em laugh they're not gonna lock me
    up." -- Red Skelton

    ------------------------------

    Date: Thu, 19 Sep 2002 18:19:22 -0400
    From: Ivan G Shreve Jr <iscreve@[removed];
    To: Old Time Radio Mailing List <[removed]@[removed];
    Subject:  Quiz answer

    Phil C. queried:

>     What zany, deep-voiced comedian starred in several OTR series (including a
>     daily one in 1945-6 with his name in the title, sponsored by Procter and
>     Gamble and often having spoofs of westerns) and appeared often (for a
>     period) on Bob Hope's and Edgar Bergen's OTR shows?

    I'm sure I won't be the first to answer this, but it's Jack Kirkwood.

    Ivan ("Put somethin' in the pot, [removed]")
    --
    "I know I'm [removed] as long as I make 'em laugh they're not gonna lock me
    up." -- Red Skelton

    ------------------------------

    Date: Thu, 19 Sep 2002 18:19:30 -0400
    From: "alanladdsr" <alanladdsr@[removed];
    To: "OTR message" <[removed]@[removed];
    Subject:  20 questions
    X-Converted-To-Plain-Text: from multipart/alternative
    X-Converted-To-Plain-Text: Alternative section used was text/plain

    To add to the "confusion" does anyone remember Slater saying "And Johnny
    McPhee, our young high school student" when introducing the Vandeventers and
    Polaise?  Who-he?

      *** This message was altered by the server, and may not appear ***
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    ------------------------------

    Date: Thu, 19 Sep 2002 18:19:56 -0400
    From: Fred Berney <berney@[removed];
    To: [removed]@[removed]
    Subject:  Re: CASS-CD

>     Jeff Bankens asked about transferring cassettes to CDs. Someone should
>     make up an index of where this question can be answered. I know it has
>     been posted many times here.

    Jeff, you can do this yourself and if you actually have several hundreds of
    cassettes, you will save yourself a lot of money by doing it yourself. My
    studio charges $100 per hour to transfer audio from one media to another.
    The reason it is so high is that it has to be done in real time. Even if I
    don't have to sit with the transfer, it ties up equipment.

    Basically all you need is a sound card (which most computers have), a
    software program for recording audio (many of which are available as either
    freeware or shareware), and a cable that goes between your cassette deck
    and your sound card. Just make sure you are going from the line output of
    your cassette player to the line (not mike) input of your sound card.

    Not all sound cards have line or aux inputs, but most do. Not all cassettes
    players have line out, but most do, except for the small $[removed] player,
    that may only have an earphone out jack.

    Record the audio from your cassette player via the software onto your
    computers hard drive. Then you can either burn an audio CD that will play
    in just about every audio CD player and almost all DVD players. Or you can
    burn an MP3 file that will allow you to store a lot more material on a
    single disc, but with the possibility that it may not play on all of your
    MP3 players and if overly compressed, may reduce sound quality.

    Somewhere in my files, I have a step by step description on how to do all
    of this. If you have not received a dozen or so replies explaining the
    procedure, email me and I'll try and dig it out for you.

    Fred
    [removed]

    Fred
    For the best in Old Time Radio Shows [removed]

    ------------------------------

    Date: Thu, 19 Sep 2002 18:20:04 -0400
    From: "alanladdsr" <alanladdsr@[removed];
    To: "OTR message" <[removed]@[removed];
    Subject:  William Johnstone
    X-Converted-To-Plain-Text: from multipart/alternative
    X-Converted-To-Plain-Text: Alternative section used was text/plain

    We all know the greatness of Parley Baer, Virginia Gregg, Jeanette Nolan,
    Joseph Julian, Hans Conried, Elliott and Cathy Lewis, many others, but we hear
    nothing (or very little) about the persona of William Johnstone. He could do
    everything, said Elliott Lewis. And he performed throughout the golden years,
    on both coasts, worked with everybody in major and minor roles from the 30's
    thru the 50's! Why is nothing said about him? I never hear stories,
    rememberances, quotes from or about him.
    One of my [removed] [removed]'s forgotten man!

      *** This message was altered by the server, and may not appear ***
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    ------------------------------

    Date: Thu, 19 Sep 2002 18:20:13 -0400
    From: "Philip Chavin" <philchav@[removed];
    To: [removed]@[removed]
    Subject:  Answer to mini-quiz

         Recently I posted a mini-quiz (What zany comedian starred in several
    OTR series ... and appeared often on Bob Hope's and Edgar Bergen's OTR
    shows?).  Hints and answer follow:

         HINTS:
      "Are ya listenin'?"
      "Ah'm a-goin', ah'm a-goin' fast. But before ah go ah got somethin' to
    [removed]"
      "Put something in the pot, boy."

         ANSWER (backwards):
      doowkriK kcaJ

            -- Phil C.

    ------------------------------

    Date: Thu, 19 Sep 2002 18:20:40 -0400
    From: leemunsick@[removed]
    To: [removed]@[removed]
    Subject:  20 Van Deventers?

    I am Van chagrined.  My posting was based on:

    1) my recollection as a steady listener to "Twenty Questions" (years ago,
    remember?), and
    2) John Dunning's entry on same in his "Encyclopedia of Old-Time Radio".

    I do not pretend to be an expert on "Twenty Questions", just a fan.  Which
    is why I cited Dunning's large work, which did not give the familial
    aspects of the program as indicated in several more recent postings.  All
    of which raises the question:  Did the Van Deventers own and/or produce the
    show?

    [removed] there a store-bought, home-use version of the game from which
    they may have garnered the profits?  One hopes!

    Unfortunately the other Dunning works and most of the rest of my reference
    library are still packed away, as one remnant of our move from
    traffic-ridden New Jersey to drought-ridden central Virginia.

    Thus said, again I'm delighted innocently to have provoked such a plethora
    of information about the show and its "family of panelists".  Little did I
    know!   Fascinating.

    The OTR/D and its alert contributors catch the gold ring once again!

    Thanks to all who responded.  Lee Munsick

    ------------------------------

    Date: Thu, 19 Sep 2002 18:20:51 -0400
    From: Ruk77@[removed]
    To: [removed]@[removed]
    Subject:  MOST OVER RATED OTR SHOWS

    what do you all think are the most over rated shows in OTR?
    off the top of my head, the first one that comes to mindf is Fred Allen. I
    LOVE Jack Benny but have never really 'got' Fred Allen. TOO [removed] about
    abbot & costello??

    ------------------------------

    Date: Thu, 19 Sep 2002 18:21:09 -0400
    From: Ruk77@[removed]
    To: [removed]@[removed]
    Subject:  A way to recover Lost shows???

     Yes, I have too much spare time on my hands [removed]
    It is my understanding that sound waves travell forever, meaning that every
    radio wave transmitted from this earth is on a continuous journey through
    space. All we would have to do is figure out a way to travell at the speed of
    light , then get in front of the radio waves with a transmitter and tune
    in!!!! I guess what ever time period you would want to pick up would depend
    on your location in [removed] may have to travel 2 light years past a
    location that picks up 1945 broadcasts to pick up 1946 broadcasts.
        Who knows, maybe in a few hundred years it will be possible. Just Imagine
    being able to hear any radio broadcast that was ever transmitted. My first
    interest would be the Lost I Love A Mystery [removed] wonder what other people
    would want to listen to if the opportunity presented itself.
        Oh to [removed]

    ------------------------------

    Date: Thu, 19 Sep 2002 18:21:32 -0400
    From: "joe@[removed]" <sergei01@[removed];
    To: "OTR List" <[removed]@[removed];
    Subject:  Ranger answers

>     I notice that
>     in some of the shows when we get to the curtain falling point, they used the
>     theme music from The Shadow as a bridge.  Did they stop using this music
>     when The Shadow went on the air?

    I am not sure what you are referring to in regard to the Shadow, but the
    half time music for the LR was a track originally written for the movie
    serials "Turmoil", one of my favs. The complete story is in the book
    "Mystery of the Masked Man's Music" if you can find a copy. Author is Reg
    Jones. If you love the music you will loev the book. Fascinating story.
    Later Turmoil faded out into the sunset to be replaced by Les Preludes by
    Liszt.

    Joe Salerno

    ------------------------------

    Date: Thu, 19 Sep 2002 18:22:11 -0400
    From: Harry Bartell <bartell@[removed];
    To: <[removed]@[removed];
    Subject:  Rehearsals

    Michael Hayde wrote:

    Harry Bartell answered a question about DRAGNET rehearsals:

> >     The no-rehearsal syndrome did not happen often <snip>.  If it did occur,
> >     actors never knew there would be no rehearsal.

>     Wait a minute, Harry!  Four years ago, when I asked you about doing the
>     radio show, you told me, quote: "Rehearsals were practically non-existent.
>     You sat around and drank coffee and talked, and then you did the show."

>     So who should I believe: you, or you? ;-)

    Don't listen to me. Listen to ME.

    Actually there is no big discrepancy. Sitting around talking and drinking
    coffee gave the actors time to mark and study their roles  even though there
    was no runthrough on mike. The incident I referred to didn't have even that
    much time available. It was arrive at the studio and record.

    See?

    Harry Bartell

    ------------------------------

    Date: Thu, 19 Sep 2002 19:46:08 -0400
    From: "Stephen A Kallis, Jr." <skallisjr@[removed];
    To: [removed]@[removed]
    Subject:  Classical Music

    John Mayer cites a snippet of Omphales' Spinning Wheel as a musical
    bridge in The Lone Ranger.  That radio show used bits and pieces from all
    sorts of composers, from Beethoven through Gliere.   The addition of
    "classical" music added a feeling of grandeur to the program.

    Stephen A. Kallis, Jr.

    ------------------------------

    Date: Fri, 20 Sep 2002 05:38:13 -0400
    From: Zharold138@[removed]
    To: [removed]@[removed]
    Subject:  The world's Greatest OTR

           HI Anybody,
      I sent away for the "The World's Greatest OTR" .99 cent offer about a month
    or so ago and I received their package this week and of the six cassettes
    only two shows (English Sherlock Holmes) were shows I didn't [removed]
    "cassette holder",which you had to put together,which I believe you had to be
    Chinese to do it as I ended up super glueing it together and then the tapes
    woulded fit in the holder but to top it all off the cassette player and radio
    which had two speakers were laying loose inside   the radio ahd when I went
    to play the thing neither radio or tape player worked . I was going to send
    my check for .99 cents and cancel out of their offer but I decided as I
    didn't receive anything of value I sent them a letter about what I received (
    minus the check). The box everything came in wasn't damaged in any way.
       Till Next Time,Harold
      See u at Newark next month.

    ------------------------------

    Date: Fri, 20 Sep 2002 05:39:06 -0400
    From: Elizabeth McLeod <lizmcl@[removed];
    To: <[removed]@[removed];
    Subject:  Re: CBS -- In The Beginning

    Tim Cronin wrote:

>     	At the start, did the network ID as the "Columbia Phonograph
>     Broadcasting System," as was reported at least once this morning during
>     the network's miniature salute to itself?
>     	Obviously, there are no recordings of the first few months, so we have
>     to rely on recollection and contempory printed reports, but I'm curious
>     as to when, if it happened at all, CPBS changed to CBS.

    There's no indication in any contemporary account of the CBS sign-on
    festivities that the "Columbia Phonograph Broadcasting System" name was
    ever used on air -- and, in fact, the same issue of Radio Digest which
    featured the article on the network startup featured a full-page ad
    listing the initial roster of stations, and identifying the organization
    as simply "The Columbia Broadcasting System." Gleason Archer refers to
    the network signing on as "The Columbia Phonograph Broadcasting System"
    in "Big Business and Radio" (1938) but I tend to think the primary source
    is the more reliable.

    Subsequent accounts in Radio Digest and other publications during 1927-28
    refer simply to "Columbia" or "The Columbia Network." I don't think I've
    seen "CBS" show up in print until 1929 or 1930.

>     	And while we're at it, wasn't CBS originally going to be known as UIB,
>     for United Independent Broadcasters?

    Now we get into the interesting part of the story -- UIB was one of
    several corporate entities formed by Arthur Judson and George Coats in
    1926-27, and the more you look at their activities during this period,
    the more you have to wonder how they managed to stay out of jail, let
    alone how they managed to stay in business.

    As the Radio Digest article noted, Judson was a promoter in the Sol Hurok
    sense of the word -- an impresario who specialized in presenting
    high-class concert artists on various New York stages. But his associate
    George Coats seems to have been more of a promoter in the Kingfish sense
    of the word -- a slick-talking entrepreneur with the habit of setting up
    grandiose-sounding corporations and lining up investors -- only to have
    those corporations never quite live up to their prospectuses. (The 1920s
    and the 1990s have more in common than we think.) And as much as CBS
    might not care to acknowledge Judson's and Coats's role in their origin,
    they're in fact descended from what looks for all the world like a poorly
    managed, rickety promotional scheme in which none of the principals
    seemed to know quite what they were doing.

    Judson was originally less interested in starting a radio network than in
    finding a new outlet for his roster of musical artists. His first venture
    in this direction was the Judson Radio Program Corporation, formed in
    1926. His idea was to act as a middleman between sponsors and networks --
    an independant packager of radio programming, using talent under contract
    to the company. He approached David Sarnoff with this idea in the fall of
    1926, but was shown the door almost immediately -- the better for Sarnoff
    to help himself to the idea, and use it as the basis for the NBC Artists
    Bureau.

    Judson and his associate Coats then decided to try to start a network of
    their own, and they had everything they needed to do it except money,
    radio stations, and any knowledge of the broadcasting business. So they
    went right ahead and had certificates printed for stock shares in United
    Independant Broadcasters and divided them up among themselves -- and then
    without the slightest idea of how to start a radio network, Coats hit the
    road to find affiliates. The idea was that UIB would pay each affiliate a
    flat rate of $500 for a guarantee of ten hours per week of broadcast time
    -- and most stations of this era being shoestring operations, most of
    them jumped at the chance -- even though the network didn't exist
    anywhere but on paper. With nothing but promises, Coats signed up a dozen
    affiliates -- but still didn't have any way to deliver on the promises.

    The big problem was raising the money to lease the network lines from
    AT&T - and this was where Coats got lucky. In the spring of 1927, Coats
    managed to convince the president of the Columbia Phonograph Corporation
    to buy $163,000 worth of time on the new network -- and pay cash up front
    for it. The idea was that Columbia Phonograph would then resell this
    time, in ten-hour units to other clients. The Columbia Phonograph
    Broadcasting Company was set up as a paper corporation to handle this
    work -- with its stock divided up among a number of additional investors,
    none of whom had anything to do with Judson, Coats, or UIB.  The only
    link between the two corporations was the contract for Columbia to buy
    the time from UIB.

    Columbia handed over the money with no guarantee that Coats and Judson
    would ever get the network off the ground, but they were able -- perhaps
    with a bit of political arm twisting -- to get AT&T to lease the
    necessary lines. Meanwhile, Coats and Judson finally realized they knew
    nothing about broadcasting, and sold Major J. Andrew White 200 shares of
    stock in UIB in order to get access to his expertise. However, even White
    was unable to do anything meaningful in the way of lining up clients
    because of the clumsy arrangement with Columbia -- no sponsor wanted to
    share sponsorship credit with another company for its programs. It was
    perhaps because of this that "Phonograph" was apparently not used on air.

    When the new network finally signed on, there were three corporations
    involved -- Judson Radio Program Corporation, which assembled the
    programming -- United Independant Broadcasters, which arranged for the
    network lines, and Columbia Phonograph Broadcasting Company, which
    fronted the cash and made its contract talent available for broadcasting.
    None of these three corporations had any control over the others, and all
    were most concerned with their own interests. Columbia Phonograph lost
    $100,000 on the project over the first month of the project, sold no
    sponsors whatsoever, and dropped out. That cut off the cash flow before
    the network was a month old. They did, however, leave their name behind
    -- figuring any advertising is good advertising -- and also retained the
    block of time they had bought, to be used for their own "Columbia
    Phonograph Hour," at that time the only sponsored program on the chain.

    It was here that George "Kingfish" Coats saved the network. With a
    mountain of debt, no source of income, no future prospects, and no assets
    other than a pile of essentially worthless stock certificates, Coats sold
    a Philadelphia millionaire named J. H. Louchheim an interest in the
    company and got him to agree to put up the money to keep it running.
    Loucheim then pooled his shares with a minority interest Coats had sold
    to the Levy brothers -- owners of WCAU -- and took a controlling interest
    in UIB, with Judson and Coats retaining most of the rest of the stock, as
    well as control of the Judson Radio Program Corporation, which had a
    five-year contract to produce programs for the network. A few sponsors
    signed on -- very few -- but the losses continued to mount.

    Over the next eight months, Louchheim flushed a fortune into UIB, and
    lost it all -- although he got plenty of additional stock certificates to
    show for his investment. Finally, in September of 1928, Loucheim -- by
    this time ready to kill Coats on sight -- jumped at the chance to dump
    the whole soggy mess into the lap of a snappy-dressing 27-year-old
    millionaire whose family's company -- Congress Cigar Co. -- was one of
    the few Columbia sponsors. William Paley then convinced his father and
    several of his uncles to join him in the venture -- and took a three
    month leave of absence from the cigar business to see if the new purchase
    was worth anything.

    One of the first things the new owner did was clean up the messy
    corporate structure. The Columbia Broadcasting Company was dissolved, but
    its name was kept -- and on 1/3/29, United Independant Broadcasters
    officially changed its name to Columbia Broadcating System Inc. Judson
    and Coats retained Judson Radio Program Corporation, along with their
    minority interest in the new CBS -- but from here on, Paley was in
    control. The network lost over $380,000 thru the end of 1928, but it
    would never have another losing year.

    Harlan Zinck wonders,

>     Out of curiosity, is there any evidence to indicate that the first
>     broadcast was recorded, in whole or in part? I know CBS didn't regularly
>     record their own broadcasts until well into the 1930's, but is there any
>     chance that a pile of dusty experimental airchecks of this broadcast are
>     out there waiting to be uncovered?

    One would think that Columbia Phonograph might have recorded some of it -
    - they did occasional experimental off-air recordings during the late
    twenties while testing one recording head or other -- but nothing's ever
    surfaced. It probably would be disappointing even if we did have
    recordings -- a monstrous thunderstorm that afternoon over  the Eastern
    US rendered the broadcast essentially unlistenable for much of the
    audience. The storm was so severe that none of the stations west of
    Buffalo got any more than a few minutes of the program.

    Elizabeth

    ------------------------------

    Date: Fri, 20 Sep 2002 05:39:29 -0400
    From: Sandy Singer <sinatradj@[removed];
    To: [removed]@[removed]
    Subject:  AN INTERVIEW WITH GOD

    [removed]

    [removed]

    --------------------------------
    End of [removed] Digest V2002 Issue #365
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