Subject: [removed] Digest V01 #152
From: <[removed]@[removed]>
Date: 5/21/2001 8:20 AM

To: <[removed]@[removed];

    ------------------------------

                          The Old-Time Radio Digest!
                             Volume 01 : Issue 152
                       A Part of the [removed]!
                               ISSN: 1533-9289

                               Today's Topics:

     Re: A&A Log                          [Elizabeth McLeod <lizmcl@[removed]]
     Shortwave-to end a thread            ["Eric Cooper" <ejcooper2001@[removed]]
     New OTR on the Net                   [SeptSev@[removed]                    ]
     BBC (Was: Re: shortwave radio and Si ["Marie A. Lamb" <malamb@[removed]]
     Barbara Watkins                      ["Lois Culver" <lois@[removed];  ]
     Re: Video to computer                [Richard Novak <rnovak@[removed];      ]
     War of the Rights                    ["Stephen A Kallis, Jr." <skallisjr@]
     OTR With a Spin?                     ["Stephen A Kallis, Jr." <skallisjr@]
     Johnny Dollar recordings             [DanHaefele@[removed]                 ]
     WHDH History-- Bob & Ray             [Donna Halper <dlh@[removed]; ]
     Re: Re:Video to computer             [Fred Berney <berney@[removed];      ]
     Re: MP3                              [Fred Berney <berney@[removed];      ]
     Re: Mutual                           [Fred Berney <berney@[removed];      ]
     Gwen Bagni Dubov                     [george aust <austhaus1@[removed]]
     Life of Riley                        [Tyrone Settlemier <settlet@[removed];]
     BBC Shortwave Broadcasts             ["A. Joseph Ross" <lawyer@[removed].]
     TV-ready radios                      ["Ed Ellers" <ed_ellers@[removed];    ]
     Gwen Bagni Dubov                     ["Stewart Wright" <stewwright@worldn]

    ______________________________________________________________________

        ADMINISTRIVIA:

           If anyone else here who hasn't already contacted me received
           unsolicited commercial email ("spam") advertising a certain
           commercial OTR website, and would like to submit a formal
           complaint for this site harvesting your email address and
           sending you a 20+ kilobyte spam email message without your
           direct request, please contact me at listmaster@[removed];
           I will supply you with the proper upstream addresses where you
           may file your complaint. (Apparently at least some posters'
           email addresses were harvested by this spammer, and our
           server rejected TEN seperate attempts to send this spam to
           addresses here on Sunday as well - we've been deluged by this
           unwanted commercial mail before, and so reject all attempts to
           connect to our SMTP server.)

           So there is no confusion, no one here had anything to do with
           that piece of spam; we do not make available our list of
           subscribers for ANY REASON WHATSOEVER! If ANYONE, at ANY TIME,
           believes they have been the victim of spamming because of
           posting here, please contact me IMMEDIATELY; I promise to do
           everything I possibly can to help you track down and report
           these miscrients. We have zero-tolerance for this crap, and
           will not permit a few bad apples limit the enjoyment of our
           thousands of subscribers.

    ______________________________________________________________________

    ------------------------------

    Date: Sun, 20 May 2001 18:04:16 -0400
    From: Elizabeth McLeod <lizmcl@[removed];
    To: <[removed]@[removed];
    Subject:  Re: A&A Log

    Diane wonders,

>     Does anyone know of a log for Amos 'n' Andy?

    No complete A&A log exists, although the full run of scripts is preserved
    at USC, and a rough listing of half-hour episode titles kept by Charlie
    Correll is also extant. (These titles were usually only one or two words
    long, however, and rarely give much indication of the plot of the
    program.) One of my long term projects is to assemble as complete a log
    as possible, although my primary interest is the pre-1943 serial version
    of the program. Daily plot summaries of all A&A episodes from 3/19/28
    thru 12/31/31 are currently available online at
    [removed]~[removed], and additional years are
    being added as they are completed.

    I've done partial work over the past several years on a log for the
    half-hour series, and while I have confirmed all dates on which episodes
    were broadcast, and the number of episodes aired in each season, there
    are still 136 out of the 426 sitcom episodes for which I lack plot
    descriptions. Eventually I hope to get out west to spend some time taking
    notes on this aspect of the series. In the meantime, however, I do have
    the most complete A&A cast listing available at
    [removed]~[removed]

    Elizabeth

    ------------------------------

    Date: Sun, 20 May 2001 18:04:26 -0400
    From: "Eric Cooper" <ejcooper2001@[removed];
    To: <[removed]@[removed];
    Subject:  Shortwave-to end a thread

    Shortwave radio broadcast listening is rather off topic for this digest, so
    let me give the address to a site that not only has all of the info for that
    that you'll ever need, but also has links to the BBC's domestic Radio 4,
    where you can still hear radio drama without having to call it "OTR"

    [removed]

    Eric Cooper

    ------------------------------

    Date: Sun, 20 May 2001 18:43:41 -0400
    From: SeptSev@[removed]
    To: [removed]@[removed]
    Subject:  New OTR on the Net

    Dear Sheryl:

    I've always thought this would be a wonderful idea.  I believe the key would
    be professional writing and acting.  There are retired actors with radio
    experience, and many younger actors who would love to work with these people
    (speaking as a former professional actor and voice over performer.)  I don't
    know if there are writers out there who used to work in radio, but speaking
    as a current professional television writer, I'd love to work with guys that
    used to do that.  It would be a fantastic learning experience.

    The recent settlement of the WGA contract gives certain juristiction to the
    Guild regarding internet work, and I'm sure that AFTRA for actors has similar
    rules, but the medium is so new that I'm also sure the professional guilds
    would co-operate in such a worthwhile effort.  Perhaps a corporate sponsor
    could be convinced to finance the project, or even a University communication
    department.  At any rate, count me in if it ever gets past the dream state.

    Thom Bray
    In a message dated 5/20/01 2:05:42 PM, Sheryl Smith writes:

>     Has anyone thought of getting a couple of older performers and younger
>     performers together on a regular basis to put on a radio show with
>     all-new material, in hopes of getting a new audience on the internet?
>     I'm not sure that everybody wants to hear recreations of old scripts,
>     but I do think that audio drama itself is still viable:  there are so
>     many situations where the audience is free to listen to something, but
>     not free to watch anything, and local commercial radio is too boring for
>     at least some of us.  :-)

    ------------------------------

    Date: Sun, 20 May 2001 18:48:22 -0400
    From: "Marie A. Lamb" <malamb@[removed];
    To: [removed]@[removed]
    Subject:  BBC (Was: Re: shortwave radio and Singing Lady)

    Jim Amash asked if it will still be possible for him to hear the BBC World
    Service on shortwave after they end their broadcasts that are targeted
    to North America.  The answer is yes; I produce a weekly program about
    shortwave listening, so I know whereof I speak.  However, to hear them on
    shortwave, we will have to listen to broadcasts that are targeted to other
    parts of the world.  While some will not be the easiest to hear, there are
    some transmissions meant for areas like Africa and Europe that should be
    audible for many shortwave listeners in North America as well.  Some may
    not be at the most convenient times for listeners in the [removed] and Canada,
    but there will still be some possibilities for hearing BBCWS on shortwave.
    Thank goodness for the ionosphere, which makes it possible to hear many
    shortwave broadcasts well outside their intended target areas!

    Marie Lamb
    WAER Jazz 88
    Syracuse University

    ------------------------------

    Date: Sun, 20 May 2001 20:38:39 -0400
    From: "Lois Culver" <lois@[removed];
    To: "OTR Digest" <[removed]@[removed];
    Subject:  Barbara Watkins

    How good to see Barbara Watkins among the OTR Digest group!  She is one of
    the really movers at SPERDVAC, and a truly nice lady!  Welcome, Barbara!

    Lois Culver
    1941-44 KWLK (Mutual) Longview, WASH
    1945-1953 (sporadically) KFI (NBC) Los Angeles, CA
    Widow of Howard Culver, radio actor

    ------------------------------

    Date: Sun, 20 May 2001 20:38:41 -0400
    From: Richard Novak <rnovak@[removed];
    To: [removed]@[removed]
    Subject:  Re: Video to computer

>     Date: Sat, 19 May 2001 10:20:25 -0400
>     From: Brent Pellegrini <brentp@[removed];
>     To: <[removed]@[removed];
>     Subject:  Re:Video to computer

>     This is off subject but I was wondering since we can copy our old time
>     radio tapes onto a computer is there a way to copy video tapes and make a
>     cd out of them. I know there is a product called Terrapin that does this.

    I> think it is a separate unit that has a cd recoder on it and you patch it
    t>o the VCR  But I wonder if you can copy direct from the VCR onto the

>     computer?

    These days you can copy almost any media to almost any media.
    Sony has a Vaio scheduled for next year with all this functionality built
    into it.
    In the meantime, to keep it simple, you need a video capture card, and a good
    cd burning utility such as Nero. (And a HUGE hard drive.)
    With this you can burn [removed] compliant CDs.
    If you need more info email me privately, this is too off-topic for a
    continued discussion here. (rnovak@[removed])

    [removed]

    ------------------------------

    Date: Sun, 20 May 2001 20:38:45 -0400
    From: "Stephen A Kallis, Jr." <skallisjr@[removed];
    To: [removed]@[removed]
    Subject:  War of the Rights

    David Easter, remarking on my observation that just because War of the
    Worlds might be being in production doesn't mean that the story still is
    protected, notes,

>     specific rights need to be considered. In this case, rights to the
>     novel, performance rights(?), screen rights, and rights to the radio
>     script.

    Quite right, _if_ the story is still protected.  I don't know.  I think
    the only practical way to find out would be to do a search through some
    law firm.

>     Bottom line probably involves who is performing, who the organization
>     is, and if money is changing hands.

    I'd add "why the performance is being done," to that.  I'd bet, for
    instance, if it's purely educational, that might make a big difference.

    Stephen A. Kallis, Jr.

    ------------------------------

    Date: Sun, 20 May 2001 20:38:44 -0400
    From: "Stephen A Kallis, Jr." <skallisjr@[removed];
    To: [removed]@[removed]
    Subject:  OTR With a Spin?

    Jim Wood, speaking of early radios with potential TV additives, noted,

>     [O]ne Stewart Warner set I purchased from Goodwill for $1 (this was in
>     about 1954), the two cord-tip jacks labeled "Televison" bridged the
>     primary of the output transformer, with capacitor/resistor coupling that
>     applied a DC bias to the output as well.  When a neon bulb was connected
>     to these terminals it flashed in time to the music, but, alas, I was born
>     to late to tune in the experimental TV broadcasts that originally were
>     broadcast on the standard AM band.

    Oddly, in 1947, I got a Daisy Handbook (from the folk who brought us the
    Red Ryder Carbine BB Gun).  On page 51, there is a description of an
    early television system using two perforated and synchronized wheels --
    one at the transmitter and one at the receiver -- with the receiver's
    wheel in front of a "neon or other gaseous lamp" to replicate a scan
    function.

    Possibly, Jim's Stewart Warner was set up for this sort of application.

    Stephen A. Kallis, Jr.

    ------------------------------

    Date: Sun, 20 May 2001 21:57:59 -0400
    From: DanHaefele@[removed]
    To: [removed]@[removed]
    Subject:  Johnny Dollar recordings

        One of SPERDVAC's librarians asked me to make a new loan copy of a Yours
    Truly, Johnny Dollar tape in the group's library.  To my great frustration, I
    find that all six shows on the master tape are in awful sound.  There's got
    to be someone out there with better sound quality than these.
        The six programs are "The Ellen Dear Matter" 1-6-57; "The DeSalles"
    1-13-57;  "The Blooming Blossom Matter" 1-20-57; "The Mad HatterMatter"
    1-27-57; "The Curby Will Matter" 2-3-57 and "The Templeton Matter" 2-10-57.
        I'll be delighted to swap with individuals with nice clean copies of any
    of these broadcasts.  Please contact me directly: DanHaefele@[removed] or
    SPERDVAC@[removed].  Many thanks!

    ------------------------------

    Date: Sun, 20 May 2001 23:17:46 -0400
    From: Donna Halper <dlh@[removed];
    To: [removed]@[removed]
    Subject:  WHDH History-- Bob & Ray

>     Sheryl wrote--

>     I'd also like to learn more about station WHDH.  That's where Bob & Ray
>     met and got their start, and judging from the shows that survive, it
>     must have been a special place to work.  I'm hoping to understand more
>     about this from people who worked there.

    Some of the old-timers who worked there are people you have already been in
    touch with.  Alas, we media folks have not always done a great job of
    preserving our own history, and much of what was WHDH is long gone.  A good
    profile of the station's history exists on the Boston Radio Archives, but
    at the risk of committing heresy, WHDH was no more and no less special than
    many of the Middle-of-the-Road stations of the 40s and early 50s, when
    numerous stations were still live and top-40 had not taken over
    completely.  WHDH, WEEI and WBZ in Boston all still had famous or high
    profile personalities, and so did many heritage AM stations in other
    cities, all throwbacks to the days when radio drama and radio comedy were
    not just taken from the network but also created locally.   I am not saying
    Bob and Ray weren't amazing-- they were gifted and their comic genius will
    undoubtedly stand the test of time.  BUT, the sort of material they did was
    more because THEY were talented, rather than because WHDH was a special
    station.  I hope I am making  sense with this comment, because yes there
    were some entire stations which maintained a standard of excellence, but in
    most cases, a station had one show that stood out from all the others, and
    they promoted that show heavily.

    The problem in discussing the OTR era, it seems to me, is when I read
    glowing and nostalgic tributes to OTR (not necessarily on this list!) that
    glorify the programming of the golden age as if every show was
    legendary.  Truth be told, much old-time radio was mediocre and has not
    stood the test of time; even the critics of that era regularly took certain
    shows to task for being boring, un-original,  lacking in humour,
    etc.  Sometimes it's not easy to differentiate between the real legends and
    the people who were simply part of the live radio era, a time which
    demanded constant creativity and new ideas.   Bob and Ray were old time
    radio at its best.  WHDH also had some wonderful personalities who did not
    specialise in comedy-- they did interviews with celebrities, played a wide
    range of big band and middle of the road music, and generally befriended
    the audience in those transitional years between OTR and the modern era--
    announcers such as Bob Clayton, Fred B. Cole, and Ken & Bill were people my
    parents listened to, so I recall hearing them when I was growing up.  What
    WHDH did  reflected the last gasp of the way radio used to be done. The
    station began in Gloucester, MA, a town devoted to the commercial fishing
    industry, and when it was allowed to move to Boston, it had to work hard to
    shed its image as a suburban station for fishermen.  Having strong
    personality radio and playing the best music of the era somewhat
    compensated for the at times poor signal and the changing image.  WHDH
    remained faithful to the style of personality old-time radio well into the
    70s-- they may have tried to play more modern ("Adult Contemporary") music,
    but the last vestiges of the old-time announcing style could still be heard
    in the 80s with Jess Cain, a genius of a morning show host, and the much
    loved overnight legend Norm Nathan.  Few of today's announcers were trained
    in that era, however, so we don't encounter many contemporary [removed]'s who
    learned the ART of entertaining the way some of the OTR announcers did.

    ------------------------------

    Date: Mon, 21 May 2001 10:06:08 -0400
    From: Fred Berney <berney@[removed];
    To: [removed]@[removed]
    Subject:  Re: Re:Video to computer

    Yes, you can copy video to your computer from a VCR. You need a video
    capture card. If you have a digital camera, there is a cable IEEE 1394,
    sometimes called "fire wire". It works only with a digital signal.

    Most if not all digital video cameras have this kind of connection. Some of
    the new computers come with this type of connection. I believe that the MAC
    has it built in. If your computer does not have this connection, you an buy
    an IEEE 1394 card for your computer. But, again, this type of connection is
    only for digital cameras or recorders.

    To connect a standard analog VCR to you computer, you will need a video
    capture card. These range in price from a couple of hundred dollars to
    several thousand. A few years ago, I purchased a very inexpensive one made
    by FAST for $[removed] About two years after that, I bought a much better one
    also made by FAST. Prices had been coming down and I still paid $800, but I
    got a much better card for the price.

    Last year I purchased an entire editing system from Pinnacle. It cost me
    about $2700. Today, that system is selling for under $2000.

    If you just want one for your own personal use and not for a business, you
    can get one for around $500 or $600. Make sure the card can handle a full
    size image, which for video is 720 x 480. This is NTSC format used in the
    [removed]

    Also, you want to be able to capture at a rate of 30 frames per second.
    Anything less and you will see a kind of strobing in the video.

    Once you get the video captured into your computer, you can save it as a
    AVI file. I'm now referring to a PC. The MAC uses a different video file
    format.

    You can burn a CD with a AVI file, but you will only be able to save about
    3 to 4 minutes on the CD. AVI files are big. If you want to make a VCD
    (video CD) you will need a program that encodes the AVI file into an MPEG1
    file.

    Xing makes such a program and it sells for around $[removed] Panasonic also
    makes an MPG1 encoder and it cost just under $100. You can probably find
    some shareware program. Do a search for MPEG1 Encoder.

    MPG1 has a quality that in my opinion is just below VHS. Some people feel
    it is the same and same even feel that it is slightly better than VHS.

    If you really want top quality, than you want an MPEG2 file. This is DVD
    quality. Again, you will need an MPEG2 encoder. These tend to be a little
    more costly. However, Sonic Solutions has a lite version that I think is
    under $200. Maybe even less. I bought there standard version for around
    $[removed]

    One of the features that these programs offer is the ability to put a 20
    minute MPG2 file on a standard CD. It will only play back in a computer,
    but it is DVD quality.

    If you want to burn your own DVDs, there are several burners available from
    Pioneer. The SV-201. This is a SCSI device. It use to sell for $5,000. That
    was a year ago when I bought mine. Today it sells for around $4,000.
    Pioneer also makes one that will plug into any computer and sells for just
    under $1,000.

    You can buy a MAC with it installed along with a video capture card for
    around $2300. Or you can buy it by itself. There are a few differences
    between this and the one selling for $4,000. They are most professional
    differences, so if this is for home use, the difference shouldn't matter.

    Pioneer also has a stand alone DVD recorder that is selling for around
    $2700. I'm told they are on back order.

    If you buy a system that works on a computer, you will need to encode the
    AVI file into either an MPEG1 or MPEG2 file. Encoding takes time. On my
    Pentium 700 with 384 megs of RAM, it takes me 4 hours to encode a 20 minute
    video into an MPEG1 file.

    I just bought a Terapin recorder. This is a stand alone unit that works
    like a VCR, except you use CDs instead of video tape. It records in real
    time. No encoding. The quality is very good. I think it might actually be
    better than the MPEG1 encoder I have for my computer and I thought that was
    good when I bought it.

    The Terapin has a list price is $599. When I purchased mine, the
    distributor set me up as a dealer and we can sell them for $479 including
    shipping anywhere in the USA.

    Here is a link that has about a dozen reviews on the Terapin.

    [removed]

    If you need more information about any of this email me directly. Thanks.

    Fred
    For the best in Old Time Radio Shows [removed]
    New e-commerce page [removed]

    ------------------------------

    Date: Mon, 21 May 2001 10:06:09 -0400
    From: Fred Berney <berney@[removed];
    To: [removed]@[removed]
    Subject:  Re: MP3

    "John Sloan" <jdsloan@[removed]; asked about MP3 files. We will encode
    any program from our library into MP3. Contact me directly for prices.

    Fred
    For the best in Old Time Radio Shows [removed]
    New e-commerce page [removed]

    ------------------------------

    Date: Mon, 21 May 2001 10:06:11 -0400
    From: Fred Berney <berney@[removed];
    To: [removed]@[removed]
    Subject:  Re: Mutual

     >Not too many decades ago, Mutual was up for sale. And I recall either Amway
    or Rich DeVoss, one of its founders, was considering buying the [removed];

    Amway did indeed buy the Mutual Network a number of years ago. I'm not sure
    if they still own it. I believe they bought it back in the mid 1980s.

    Fred
    For the best in Old Time Radio Shows [removed]
    New e-commerce page [removed]

    ------------------------------

    Date: Mon, 21 May 2001 10:06:13 -0400
    From: george aust <austhaus1@[removed];
    To: [removed]@[removed]
    Subject:  Gwen Bagni Dubov

    The 5/20/01 edition of  The San Gabriel Valley Tribune reported the
    death at age 88 of Gwen Bagni Dubov, an award winning writer of radio,
    tv, and movie scripts. Among her many credits the story said that she
    wrote for the popular radio drama "Suspense".

    Recently there has been discussion about whether or not "Suspense " was
    as good a show as has been touted. I don't have many episodes in my
    collection ( only 5 of them) so I really don't have an opinion on the
    show but I did recently listen to "Sorry Wrong Number". I had never
    heard the show before but I have seen the movie two or three times. I
    was very impressed with Agnes Moorheads performance and I got into it
    right away (something that doesn't come easily for me with OTR drama). I
    was enjoying it thoroughly, when all of a sudden she was apparently
    murdered and the show ended??? What happened to the rest of the plot?
    Was she murdered? If so why was she murdered? Who murdered her? Who
    hired the murderer and why? I was left with so many unanswered questions
    it was frustrating. I actually played the show over again figuring that
    I had missed something important while dodging traffic. No I hadn't! If
    I hadn't seen the movie with the complete plotline I would have been
    left completely in the dark. Did anyone else have the same reaction that
    I did? I had  no difficulty at all with the technical aspect of the show
    with the "crossed telephone wires. I recall several times in the 1940's
    and 50's when I experienced crossed wires and was able to listen in on
    another conversation. I have experienced calls where I could talk with
    them and also as in this show where the other parties could not hear me
    at all. I can also understand how if her husband had been talking with
    the "for hire murderer" (remember his line had been busy) and when they
    completed the call a relay somewhere was hung up, that it would be
    possible for her to have overheard the conversation that she did when
    she place that call again. Have I confused everybody now? Anyway it
    certainly was a show that would initiate discussion as has been seen in
    this digest recently.

    George Aust

    ------------------------------

    Date: Mon, 21 May 2001 10:06:33 -0400
    From: Tyrone Settlemier <settlet@[removed];
    To: [removed]@[removed]
    Subject:  Life of Riley

    Many thanks to all the good people who answered my question about the Life of
    Riley movie.  As promised, I have typed a transcript of the "interview"
    record that prompted the question.  The URL is at:
    [removed]~settlet/record/[removed]

    Tyrone Settlemier
    settlet@[removed] settlet@[removed]
    [removed]~settlet/[removed]

    ------------------------------

    Date: Mon, 21 May 2001 10:06:50 -0400
    From: "A. Joseph Ross" <lawyer@[removed];
    To: [removed]@[removed]
    Subject:  BBC Shortwave Broadcasts

>     Date: Sat, 19 May 2001 10:20:20 -0400
>     From: JimInks@[removed]

>     Okay.  I'm confused (which is not a rarity).  I'm getting the impression that
>     it'd still be possible to pick up the BBC broadcasts once they quit beaming
>     to the [removed]  Is that right?

    BBC shortwave broadcasts beamed to other parts of the world can often be
    picked up in the United States.  The reception usually isn't as good or as
    reliable as that of the broadcasts that are meant to be heard here, but a
    useable signal can often be heard.  BBC news also is often carried on
    local stations, especially public stations, in crystal-clear FM.  It also
    can be found fairly readily on the Internet.

     A. Joseph Ross, [removed]                        [removed]
     15 Court Square                     lawyer@[removed]
     Boston, MA 02108-2503      [removed]~lawyer/

    ------------------------------

    Date: Mon, 21 May 2001 10:07:35 -0400
    From: "Ed Ellers" <ed_ellers@[removed];
    To: <[removed]@[removed];
    Subject:  TV-ready radios

    Bill Harris <radioguy@[removed]; wrote:

    "There were a lot of sales gimmicks used to push sets, I just wonder
    exactly what the Philco instruction manual really meant about converting the
    radio to a television set?"

    It meant nothing at all.  Philco's scheme -- which they did use for
    turntables and FM converters, and planned to use for TV -- was to have the
    "attachment" transmit a low-power signal in the standard broadcast band to
    be received by the radio.  Of course, this worked with any radio -- not just
    the Philcos that bore these markings -- so all it was was a sales ploy.

    ------------------------------

    Date: Mon, 21 May 2001 10:07:37 -0400
    From: "Stewart Wright" <stewwright@[removed];
    To: <[removed]@[removed];
    Subject:  Gwen Bagni Dubov

            Gwen Bagni Dubov died Monday, May 14, 2001 in Glendale, CA.  She and
    her husband John Bagni wrote scripts for many radio series including
    "Escape" and "Suspense."  She later married actor and writer Paul Dubov.

            For the next few days you can find her obituary at
    [removed]

    Stewart

    --------------------------------
    End of [removed] Digest V01 Issue #152
    *******************************************

    Copyright [removed] Communications, York, PA; All Rights Reserved,
      including republication in any form.

    If you enjoy this list, please consider financially supporting it:
       [removed]

    For Help: [removed]@[removed]
    To Unsubscribe: [removed]@[removed]

    For Help with the Archive Server, send the command ARCHIVE HELP
      in the SUBJECT of a message to [removed]@[removed]

    To contact the listmaster, mail to listmaster@[removed]

    To Send Mail to the list, simply send to [removed]@[removed]